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General => General discussion => Topic started by: Bender on 22 February 2010, 13:10

Title: New to the game
Post by: Bender on 22 February 2010, 13:10
So my dad has just bought a Canon EOS 450D. Luckily he works all week so I'm gonna 'borrow' it and start self teaching myself some photography.

I've read a few of the things on here which are super helpful and have led to a few decent starter shots.

He's got 3 lenses, don't ask me which because I can't remember - basically a short one (think it starts at 50mm?) a medium one (135mm?) and a longer one (200mm?). Literally I know nothing of the techincal stuff.

However, I'm looking for a few starter tips regarding fstops, ISO, exposure and stuff. Basically I know f-stop is depth of field, and I've had a little play with that. ISO I've played around with and I kind of know through experimenting what it does, but would someone care to explain exactly what happens when I change the ISO, and when I should have a higher ISO etc? I've figured that the brighter it is, the higher iso you need to get the shot.
Then finally, exposure - something to do with the shutter speed? I don't have a clue what this is, or how to change it...

I know I could probably look this stuff up, and I've already read a few things. Would just like a human answer specifically for me rather than a textbook response.

Thanks in advance. :D
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: shepgti on 22 February 2010, 13:34
you got the iso round the wrong way :wink: the less light there is the higher iso you may need however this can cause noise on the photo so to counter act this you can use a longer exposure.

your best bet is to check out youtube vids as theres LOADS on there and are very very useful :cool:


edit: i find this guy to be a very good teacher http://www.youtube.com/user/PhotoGavin
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Komenda on 22 February 2010, 15:05

Yep as above, the ISO is the films (sensors) sensitivity to light, the higher the number the brighter the picture. This can be used when you don't have much avaiable light. Note that images will be noisier (speckly) than at lower ISO's.

The f no is what controls the depth of field by making the aperture of the lens bigger or small. Higher F numbers give a large depth of field with more of the image in focus. Low f numbers give focus to a particular part of the image.

Shutter is how long light is allowed to hit the sensor. Higher numbers give a very fast shutter letting in little light, capturing images very quickly. Lower numbers will let more light in but will be more susceptible to the movement of the camera.

Getting the right exposure and the image style you want means juggling the aperture and shutter until you get the result you are looking for.
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Bender on 22 February 2010, 15:15
So what setting controls the shutter speed - does it have a different name on the settings?
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Komenda on 22 February 2010, 15:18
Quote from: Bender on 22 February 2010, 15:15
So what setting controls the shutter speed - does it have a different name on the settings?

to control the shutter and leave everything else auto on Canon cameras you should have a dial that has Tv written on it. Turn it to that and you can control the shutter. To control Shutter and aperture turn it to M
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Bender on 22 February 2010, 15:53
Ok, just gone and had another little play. With the ISO I was getting that mixed up with something else. I've got the ISO settings sorted now - I'm gonna take a guess that the 1/200 or 1/whatever figure is the shutter speed? That's what I was getting lighter images with lower settings. Also it seems I can get a lower f-stop with a lower 1/? number.

Anyone care to explain that to me a little? :D
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Komenda on 22 February 2010, 16:05

If you have it in Shutter priority (Tv) mode, the camera will decide the best aperture for the conditions you are taking a shot in. If you change the shutter speed the aperture may change to compensate. Same if you change the ISO.


If you put the camera in Av mode the camera will choose the best shutter speed dependant on the aperture you choose.

If you put the camera in Manual mode, you can set the shutter and aperture you want.
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: shepgti on 22 February 2010, 16:19
or if you cant be botherd with working it all out then shoot in fully automatic  :wink:
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: DubFan on 24 February 2010, 11:22
Quote from: Bender on 22 February 2010, 15:53
I'm gonna take a guess that the 1/200 or 1/whatever figure is the shutter speed?
Yes.
Shutter speed is measured in fractions of a second, eg 1/4 (one quarter of a second = really slow = will make movement very blurry), 1/16 (one sixteenth = faster but will still get lots of blurring), all the way up to 1/1000 (one thousandth of a
second = ie one millisecond, this will freeze any action, but will need lots of light).
This is a vague guide, but of course it varies massively dependant on how much light you have (I think this assumes bright daylight), if you're using flash or the lens you're using.

Still LifeShutter speed will not affect a subject which is completely static
LandscapeLandscapes are fairly static but wind will move clouds, grass, leaves etc 1/30th of a second if you want it still. Less if you want a bit of life in it.
Street scene.1/60th - 1/125th of a second.
Your holiday photos.1/60th - 1/125th of a second.
Person walking.1/125th - 1/250th of a second.
Person running.1/500th - 1/1000th of a second.
Sport, football, rugby etc.1/250th - 1/1000th of a second and lots of practice.
Car, approx. 30 mph.1/1000th -1/2000th of a second.
Motocross.1/500th of a second and over and lots of practice.
F1 / Indy car.1/1000th of a second and over plus lots of practice.
   


If you need to capture something at a particular shutter speed, like a person walking, you'll need to set your shutter speed (eg 1/125)  and then adjust your ISO to allow enough light then adjust the aperture to get the required amount of light in and this will affect the depth of field. If the depth of field is too narrow (using say f1.8), you will need to adjust your aperture to a higher f-stop (eg f4 or f8) and then compensate by slowing the shutter speed or adjusting the ISO.

To be honest, you need to get your head around the basics of shutter speed, aperture and ISO settings first (lower number for brighter conditions; 100 for sunny days - 800 for darker conditions or indoors).
Then you can start playing with them to get more creative effects (eg slow shutter speeds for light trails; low aperture f-stop for narrow depth of field; high ISO for grainy look).
   

   
   
   

Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Ridg on 24 February 2010, 12:06
ISO affects the amount of saturation in the images too, the higher the ISO generally to less saturated the image, over exposing on a high ISO reduces a lot of the noise you get at high ISO 1000+, however it can distort the colours.

Noise / grain can also be reduced at the post processing stage, however this will lose some of the detail too.

I'm pretty sure the 450D has an auto ISO mode, which will take that out of the equation, and leave you to worry about shutter speed or aperture, or both.

the aperture and shutter speed will also effect the sharpness of on image, for example an image shot @ f/1.4 will be very soft, and photos shot handheld at anything above say 1/50 are going to lose sharpness because of ghosting caused by the camera shake.

My advice would be to mess around, with the different modes and get a handle on how the aperture affects the image and then the Shutter speed and then you can start playing with full manual mode, as sometimes, you need to control both, this is where the ISO really comes into play as well as the use of filters.

have a read of these too

http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=114162.msg996456#msg996456

http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=114170.msg996537#msg996537

http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=114168.msg996510#msg996510

Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: shepgti on 24 February 2010, 12:27
little tip i picked up to help reduce camera shake is always try to keep the shutter speed higher than the focal length ie if shooting at 100mm try to stay over 1/100 shutter speeds. :cool:
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Ridg on 24 February 2010, 13:14
Quote from: shepgti on 24 February 2010, 12:27
little tip i picked up to help reduce camera shake is always try to keep the shutter speed higher than the focal length ie if shooting at 100mm try to stay over 1/100 shutter speeds. :cool:

or use a tripod  :grin:
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Bender on 24 February 2010, 13:21
Wow, thanks for the advice guys. Just starting to get used to what affects each of the settings have now. Will post up a couple of pictures if I ever get satisfied with one :P

Also, this image has the kinda fisheye effect, but very subtle. Is that a lense effect? Or edited in PS or whatever.

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2700/4372507744_fee569c4cc.jpg)
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Ridg on 24 February 2010, 13:35
that's going to be a wide angle lens, that image is a HDR image too.
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Bender on 24 February 2010, 15:46
Ok I had a little play yesterday/today - here's my results.

Any hints/criticism is definitely welcomed :D

Wall of photos....

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4044/4385155356_986e0e4749_b.jpg)

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4002/4385148020_2692f4f976_b.jpg)

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4005/4385142858_cbafaf7010_b.jpg)

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4013/4384369623_2ab72689c5_b.jpg)

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4015/4385126528_c5d09bd174_b.jpg)

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4003/4384359977_0550cfc8b2_b.jpg)

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4071/4384375753_8a76474179_b.jpg)
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: shepgti on 24 February 2010, 15:49
got a good eye for it, the 2nd pic has a nice feel to it
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Komenda on 24 February 2010, 16:07

Cracking shots dude. Love the big cloud one
Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Ridg on 24 February 2010, 16:29
The second one is probably the best out off the bunch, but i'd say you've probably got too much foreground in it, so I'd either crop the bottom out, placing the person in the bottom third of the photo.  You could probably do some adjustments to the levels to bring out more detail in the sky too.

Forth one is nice, I'd probably add a little motion blur to it,as I'm sure the grass would have been moving in the wind.  So maybe try that on a slightly longer shutter speed.

The cloud one is the same as the rocks, you've got the foreground beach doesn't do anything and the diagonal line takes the eye away.

The piano I'd probably do in black and white.

The bench and VW are nice examples of DoF

The rock in the wash, does nothing for me, nice example of a higher shutter speed.

But the second one is good, and with some slight PP can be a cracking shot.




Title: Re: New to the game
Post by: Bender on 24 February 2010, 17:42
Thanks Ridg.

Really good to get some feedback of some people that know what they're doing :P

With the motion blur - doable in photoshop? I'll see if the suns out and go back and shoot it again with the longer shutter speed.

Rock in the wash was just trying to get the engulfing effect - not sure how to make it more than just that though. Ideally would have been a bigger rock and a bigger wave with some interesting sky. But unfortunately Cornwall doesn't provide such scenes very often....

Thanks again though guys :D