GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk6 => Topic started by: mossy1969 on 06 November 2009, 18:46
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hi there was talking to a guy today and he was amazed at the price of the new r , he also said that the engine in the r is the same as the mark 5 edition 30 i must admit i thinks he could be wrong ,,,,any information on this one
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All I know of the engine is that its the same as the Roc R. It may have the same engine as the ed30, but diff turbo's I would expect.
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Kev, I heard you were our Golf R specialist? :wink:
Mossy, The search function is your friend:
http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=131433.0 (http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=131433.0)
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Kev, I heard you were our Golf R specialist? :wink:
Mossy, The search function is your friend:
http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=131433.0 (http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=131433.0)
I'll be whatever you want me to be :kiss: :grin:
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its the old gti engine with a few upgraded internals... plus the K04 turbo from the ed30. If your looking for more details on the engine then you would probably be better off looking up the S3 :wink:
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The ED30 engine was the 'same' as the GTI engine with a bigger turbo (KO4 as opposed to normal GTI KO3s) and uprated internals. This engine was also found in the Leon Cupra and the S3. There are a few 'controversial' threads in the mk5 board over whether there was any difference between the S3 engine and ED30 engine or not and I don't think there was any conclusive evidence one way or the other. Either way the difference, if any, was minor.
I believe this is the same engine thats going in the Golf R, albeit it may have some minor tweaks over the ED30 spec but yes, fundamentally its the same.
The new TSI engine in the mk6 GTI is quite different from the mk5 engine, though its easy to see it came from the same stable.
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^ your right about those threads in the mk5 forum i was one of them involved :evil:
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Some info from SEAT Leon Cupra R press release, main differences between the 240PS Cupra engine and the 265PS CupraR engine.
The most powerful in the range
The new engine on the CUPRA R is a development of the familiar 2.0 TSI. Its 265 hp comes from a different engine management set-up, as well as greater turbo pressure compared to the 240 hp engine: 1.9 bar at maximum output and 2.2 bar at maximum torque compared to the 1.8 bar of the 240 hp 2.0 TSI.
On both the 240 and 265 hp versions, the 2.0 TSI engine features a new, high-pressure fuel-injection pump and modified catalyst in order to comply with EU-5 emissions standards; the intercooler connection pipe is also different on both models – the 265 hp version including a higher-performance intercooler.
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So some gubbins to help emissions and a remap.......ED30's clearly a good value buy.......
Anyone want to buy mine :-)
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So some gubbins to help emissions and a remap.......ED30's clearly a good value buy.......
Anyone want to buy mine :-)
No thanks mate, quite happy with my mapped mkvi.
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Same engine as the S3.
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The Golf GTI uses the new EA888 engine while the Audi S3, Golf R and Scirocco R all use the older EA113 unit. The newer EA888 engine is a much more efficient unit and has a metal cam belt as opposed to the rubber one of the EA113. The S3's engine is a proven unit that is both reliable and powerful. in truth, there is very little to choose between the two engines apart from output. Volkswagen/ Audi is simply brilliant at turbocharging small engines. The extraordinary durability of such engines despite the increased stresses they must endure to deliver significantly greater horsepower is a testament to the VAG's expertise in this area. No one can really say how good or bad the new Golf R will be yet, but given the fantastic write up the 'Roc R has received, i fully expect it get rave reviews too.
A lot of people are annoyed because the Golf R effectively makes you pay more for less, since it no longer has a VR6 engine. As someone who owned an original VR6 - and loved it, by the way - fuel usage was savage when you kept your foot down. Fuel consumption is still the big problem with today's generation of V8 supersaloons. So IMHO VW was right to make a car that was more frugal as well as more powerful. Personally, i would have loved to see the TT-RS's 5-cylinder engine in the Golf R. That motor is a beast. With something approaching 400 bhp possible, it would M3s for breakfast.
In the meantime, there is an interesting rumour that VW has been very conservative with the Golf R's acceleration figures. While 0-60 in 5.7 seconds is reportedly possible (5.5 seconds with DSG), apparently it is nearer 5 seconds. :shocked:
Of course, if the R does prove to be all hype and no substance, we have the GTI to fall back on. I think the GTI is a stunning motor. The R is going to have to be very good to command the significantly higher price VW is asking for it. I suspect VW realises this, so I'm waiting with great excitement.
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0-62 was 5.5 in DSG... therefore a little quicker to 60 is possible on top of the conservatism. no need to be conservative with DSG since no fluffed gear changes and launch control :evil:
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wouldnt be surprised if figures are actually near 5 or below. vw are very conservative with 0-60 times, just like the roc, claims 7.1, but in actual real time its around 6.5, same with the gti i believe.
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To me the GOLF R = Exclusivity!!!you are not going to find every Tom,Dick and Harry(mostly Dick$) owning one simply because they are too afraid too pay Audi S3 money for a Golf.Majority of people so far have bad mouthed the Golf R for its pricing but it simply will be the ultimate golf and arguably the ultimate VW,not to say the GTI is'nt as good its brilliant but the Golf R is just that much better.I mean who would have expected a Golf to to do 0-60 in 5.5 seconds.I just think that you wont see as many of them as a GTI or a S3 and thats what already makes it a great car.
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I was just looking at the new price list.
19s+black headlight surrounds does seem a strainge combo for them to put together as a package.
(I was looking to see if it says what the ET of the 19s were but it does not)
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For the price the R is for, I rather go for another German sports car... ha ha ha But is the R a sports car? Or just a glorified shopping car? If I am paying that much money for it, I dont want people arguing whether it is a sports car or not... he he he
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hehe - lets not start that one all over again! :laugh:
anyway - its amazing that the Golf R with only a little more bhp than the Roc R pulls to 62 up to a second quicker. the worth on 4wd I guess, but still thats an amazing difference. I guess this really highlights how the 4wd rally rice rockets were able to put down 4 to 5 second 0-60 times so easily.
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he he he no intention of starting that argument again. Just that the price is so steep, I would really want the price I paid for to show on the car that I paid the price for. I know that the Golfs are meant to be discrete and subdued. But then why would anyone pay so much to get a R when the GTI is meant to be just that? A GTI is likely not to evolve into a 4WD, so I wonder why create a R when demand for it will be much less so soon and with the older engines? Less also means more expensive due to the economics of it... Is it because it wants to compete with the Ford RS and the likes?
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But whats so special about 0-60 times? There meeningless imo unless you do proper drag race (should get a better car to start with) or do traffic light races (numty) or just have a small member so need to brag about such things.
Only numbers that make any sense in the real world are things like 30-70 through gears for overtaking trucks etc. I bet the scirocco R and Golf R are very close after they start rolling.
If you must know the sort of bragging numbers to expect just go buy a back issue of autoexpress and autocar when they tested the S3.
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But whats so special about 0-60 times? There meeningless imo unless you do proper drag race (should get a better car to start with) or do traffic light races (numty) or just have a small member so need to brag about such things.
Only numbers that make any sense in the real world are things like 30-70 through gears for overtaking trucks etc. I bet the scirocco R and Golf R are very close after they start rolling.
If you must know the sort of bragging numbers to expect just go buy a back issue of autoexpress and autocar when they tested the S3.
You're missing the point of the R!
IMO it's the AWD that is important to me for the all weather performance...
( if 0-60 is not important to you why did you buy a hot hatch? In your own words "small member"?)
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IMO it's the AWD that is important to me for the all weather performance...
I guess it depends what you class as all weather. Its no good in decent snow. You would be better off buying a secondcar for the bad times in winter. The amount of R32s, WRXs etc i noticed stranded or struggling for a few days last year i found funny as i past them all in an original mini :evil: simply because they have lots of power, weight and very wide tyres.
if 0-60 is not important to you why did you buy a hot hatch? In your own words "small member"?)
I said why in reply #19 above, overtaking of trucks, spending a small amount of time on the dangerous side of the road. :tongue:
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Agreed most performance cars a fuc£ed in heavy snow but you stand a better chance than an equivelant 2 wheel drive car...
All weather performance = safer / quicker progress most days of the year (very wet country we live in).... On the heavy snow days I'll have a lie in :tongue:
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For me a Golf R would still only be a starting point. 0-62 in 5.5seconds would easily drop below 5 seconds with just a remap. T88OMM has an S3 S-tronic (posh word for DSG!) and had REVO installed at GTI international and did a 4.8 dash to 60mph and the QTR in 13.2 at over 100mph. So, the Golf R is slightly lighter and has the bang same engine. Give it the full Stage 2+ treatment (approx £2,800 from stock)and a DSG remap and you are looking in the face of a 340-360bhp car, 0-60mph in sub 4.4 seconds and a 0-100mph dash around 10 seconds, which equates to a similar performance as.........
Ferrari 612 Scaglietti F1
Aston Martin Vanquish
and faster than........
New Porsche 997.2 Carrera C4S
E46 BMW M3 CSL
Bentley Continental GT
Mitsubishi EVO IX FQ-360
Not bad in my book
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All weather performance = safer / quicker progress most days of the year (very wet country we live in).... On the heavy snow days I'll have a lie in :tongue:
We have had 4wd cars in the past (family use to run a chain of subaru dealerships) and once your rolling theres was no benefit i felt, only lots of weight and tyres/service costs it brought with it. Each to there own though. :smiley:
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and once your rolling theres was no benefit
Getting rolling is the trick though. Front wheel drive is the worst possible drive layout in a higher powered car. When I need to go quickly I want to be able to tramp on the throttle and use all the torque right away. I'm not talking about standing start 5.5 second blasts to 60, I'm talking about greasy, wet, uneven British roads on a Monday morning going to work when I'm still half asleep need to pull out into moving traffic. Front wheel drive can let you down here, regardless of fancy electronic traction aids, driver skill etc. The simple fact is 4WD transfers 99% of the torque to the road successfully every time, regardless of how indelicate with the throttle you are.
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he he he no intention of starting that argument again. Just that the price is so steep, I would really want the price I paid for to show on the car that I paid the price for. I know that the Golfs are meant to be discrete and subdued. But then why would anyone pay so much to get a R when the GTI is meant to be just that? A GTI is likely not to evolve into a 4WD, so I wonder why create a R when demand for it will be much less so soon and with the older engines? Less also means more expensive due to the economics of it... Is it because it wants to compete with the Ford RS and the likes?
Golf R is a replacement for the R32. a model that has been around since MkIV days and a very popular model amongst enthusiasts. ETTO and all that, why deny them the Golf R?
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If you must know the sort of bragging numbers to expect just go buy a back issue of autoexpress and autocar when they tested the S3.
they have this wonderful invention nowadays called the information super-highway which has all this info available.... :laugh:
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(approx £2,800 from stock)
Mitsubishi EVO IX FQ-360
Not bad in my book
Agreed. However ide much rather start with a Stock FQ300 and give that the stage 2 treatment. Look the f**k out because you wouldn't even see the evo coming in the r.
Couple of Kids I know, One has a Stage 3.5 Corsa B, 2litre Turbo Calibre engine install, T40 turbo or something along those lines. Ive never been in something so scary. About 400bhp front wheel drive.
The other is a Twin Engine Nova each engine powering an axle. Think that has the same treatment as the above both Stage 3.5 2.0 Turbo calibre engines. And that is quite possibly the fastest thing ive laid eyes on. Cept maybe that Norris Design evo
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I agree an evo modified or not would be quicker than the R
BUT at least you won't have to hide your face in shame driving the R
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I agree an evo modified or not would be quicker than the R
BUT at least you won't have to hide your face in shame driving the R
I dont think you have anything to be ashamed of in the X nowadays. You could easily miss one driving around. Blenders imo
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I agree an evo modified or not would be quicker than the R
BUT at least you won't have to hide your face in shame driving the R
I dont think you have anything to be ashamed of in the X nowadays. You could easily miss one driving around. Blenders imo
Try telling my wife that :rolleyes:
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Try telling my wife that :rolleyes:
Ahh yes, Women and Jap have never really gone 2gether have they.
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Try telling my wife that :rolleyes:
Ahh yes, Women and Jap have never really gone 2gether have they.
So you're not keen on Japanese women? :evil:
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for me its simply down to fun factor... 4wd drift or 2wd understeer.
4wd for me everytime... the added benifit of being able to pull out into spaces smaller than the car itself also has mucho benifito :laugh:
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So you're not keen on Japanese women? :evil:
From trips to Japan for work and also friends who have Japanese wifes they don't seem interested in japanese cars just white europeen ones. :undecided:
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So you're not keen on Japanese women? :evil:
From trips to Japan for work and also friends who have Japanese wifes they don't seem interested in japanese cars just white europeen ones. :undecided:
Yes, but women have always been interested in stuff that is white.......
Washing machines, ovens, irons etc :rolleyes: :evil:
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So you're not keen on Japanese women? :evil:
From trips to Japan for work and also friends who have Japanese wifes they don't seem interested in japanese cars just white europeen ones. :undecided:
Yes, but women have always been interested in stuff that is white.......
Washing machines, ovens, irons etc :rolleyes: :evil:
:grin:... can think of one other too, cant get it in a supermarket either though :lipsrsealed: :kiss:
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^PMSL never thought of it like that. I wonder how fast my mates wife can run when i tell her thats why she likes white cars :grin:
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Golf R is a replacement for the R32. a model that has been around since MkIV days and a very popular model amongst enthusiasts. ETTO and all that, why deny them the Golf R?
I am not saying we should deny enthusiasts the R. What I am trying to say is that the R is ridiculously priced. And when you compare it to the R32s in those days, it was not as pricey as it is today. And should it not be released with the new EA888 engines instead of the older one? Why did VW need to rush it? The GTI is still new...
Am raising this for argument's sake and see what our resident experts have to say... ;)
HM
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The R type will only have 2 years on sale before the Mk7 comes along. That's why it was rushed.
Should be a good car, has anyone seen a road test yet?
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The R type will only have 2 years on sale before the Mk7 comes along. That's why it was rushed.
Should be a good car, has anyone seen a road test yet?
VW press release said road tests won't be until December / January for the Golf R.
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The Sunday Times has a road test of the Scirocco R in today's paper.
The author concludes that the normal scirocco is a much better car than the harsh and loud R version.
This might be the case with the Golf R.
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The Sunday Times has a road test of the Scirocco R in today's paper.
The author concludes that the normal scirocco is a much better car than the harsh and loud R version.
This might be the case with the Golf R.
Shock ... horror... quick, must cancel my order. The Noshmeister has spoken.
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The Sunday Times has a road test of the Scirocco R in today's paper.
The author concludes that the normal scirocco is a much better car than the harsh and loud R version.
This might be the case with the Golf R.
Not exactly. He just said the standard Scirocco was so 'nuanced and complete' he didn't think he'd have enjoyed himself any less in the non-R version.
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The Sunday Times has a road test of the Scirocco R in today's paper.
The author concludes that the normal scirocco is a much better car than the harsh and loud R version.
This might be the case with the Golf R.
Not exactly. He just said the standard Scirocco was so 'nuanced and complete' he didn't think he'd have enjoyed himself any less in the non-R version.
Don't forget the crude and unruly bit
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Don't forget the crude and unruly bit
I'm blinkered and being lead astray by the VW-love on this forum. :grin:
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Don't forget the crude and unruly bit
I'm blinkered and being lead astray by the VW-love on this forum. :grin:
Strength through Joy
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Don't forget the crude and unruly bit
I'm blinkered and being lead astray by the VW-love on this forum. :grin:
Strength through Joy
I thought Joy was a BMW thing? :grin:
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I thought Joy was a BMW thing? :grin:
Type it into Google and you'll learn the history of VW
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I thought Joy was a BMW thing? :grin:
Type it into Google and you'll learn the history of VW
Ah ic ic
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Strength through Joy
Was Joy driving a mk6 GTI?
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http://www.zerotohundred.com/2009/auto-news/most-powerful-golf-ever-vw-releases-the-new-golf-r20/ (http://www.zerotohundred.com/2009/auto-news/most-powerful-golf-ever-vw-releases-the-new-golf-r20/)
http://www.autoblog.com/gallery/frankfurt-2009-volkswagen-golf-r20/ (http://www.autoblog.com/gallery/frankfurt-2009-volkswagen-golf-r20/)
Sorry if already posted
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Don't forget the crude and unruly bit
I'm blinkered and being lead astray by the VW-love on this forum. :grin:
Strength through Joy
I thought Joy was a BMW thing? :grin:
That's funny. I guess that BMW's next tagline will be "arbeit macht frei" which translates as if you work hard enough, you might be able to afford a three-series!
Egbert Nosh, you are both right and wrong. Although the Mark 7 will arrive in 2 years time, the GTI will be one year behind it and the R will be another 9-12 months behind that. This seems to be the timing precedent they have followed. According to my dodgy arithmetic, this makes around 4 years before the next R goes on sale. Of course, if petrol taxes go up further and the recession continues, who knows VW could even avoid making another R altogether due to reduced demand. An unlikelu scenario, I admit, but not impossible. Worse still, there is talk of the EU mandating black boxes in cars that measure speed, consumption and emissions. I so hope this never happens, but either way, now So may be the last proper R you can buy. I intend to live for the present not the future. I will order an R as soon as someone I trust has reviewed it positively.