GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk3 => Topic started by: chrissywood on 22 October 2009, 22:43
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i just brought a 2.0 16v mk3 gti it has got a supersprint cat back exhaust and a k&n iv got about £350 to spend under the bonnet to gain some power because to b honest its my first golf iv always had civics or other japcrap and i was a bit disapointed with the power and torque can any of you guys suggest where to spend the money will spend more just not loaded??
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you would of thought on a golf gti forum sum1 would no a little abot em????
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Next thing would be a remap i'd say....although if you have abit more to spend then maybe think about cams and a new p&p head.
Do a search for a member called Ess Three, he has a mk3 16v with 196bhp, sure some of his threads or answers will help. :wink:
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£350 should be enough to find yourself a fairly good VR6 engine
Only 24bhp more than the Valver but that engine noise :drool:
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Give it a good service first, clean out the throttle body and then see how it goes.
You say it has a K&n. Is that a panel filter or the induction kit. If its the induction kit try putting a cold feed to it. If its the panel filter give it a clean and do the airbox mods. All free. Should be worth a couple of bhp.
De ramp the throttle body search throttle body porting, again free. Another couple of bhp.
For £350 you aren't going to get much in the way of real performance gains, most of the cheap bolt on stuff doesn't really get you any gains if any at all.
Polished and ported head is gonna cost you more than your budget, same for cams. A lightened flywheel will probably make the most differance but your gonna need to remove the gearbox and clutch to fit it. Cost about £70.
A rolling road remap will cost you about £250, the gains will depend on many factors.
As previously said search for Ess threes thread to see what he has done.
Paul
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I would save the money, any gain will be small and not worth the money.
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I would personally focus on sorting the handling out
Decent set of coilovers, decent ARBs and Powerflex bushes. Maybe a decent set of tyres.
It's all good making the car fast but you want it to handle good aswell :smiley:
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£350 should be enough to find yourself a fairly good VR6 engine
Only 24bhp more than the Valver but that engine noise :drool:
Great noise!
But with all that extra weight... :cry:
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Buy a Dremell, first of all. £50 or so with tools.
Buy a subwoofer port for the airbox and Modify the airbox using the Dremell, add the K&N filter - a couple of BHP gained for the cost of about £50 (K&N Filter, Araldite and the cost of a Sub Port).
Modify the TB as previously suggested, using your shiny new Dremell - free.
Pick up a cheapo eBay chip for it...maybe £50 or so?
That lot should net you 5-8 BHP genuine.
£150 so far...
Get your self a spare flywheel from a breakers/classified ad for about £30.
Get it lightened at a cost of around £70.
That leaves around £100 to get the lightened flywheel fitted - that will feel like you've added 30 BHP right there.
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I would personally focus on sorting the handling out
Decent set of coilovers, decent ARBs and Powerflex bushes. Maybe a decent set of tyres.
It's all good making the car fast but you want it to handle good aswell :smiley:
Sadly, £350 will barely make a dent in that list...
You may ge the Poly bushing done for £350...
Or the ARBs...
But you sure as hell won't get springs/dampers or coilovers woth having for £350...and to properly sort the Mk3's handling woes out, you are looking at the thick end of £1500, to do a proper job....mind you, you'll have a pretty impressive handling Mk3 for your money.
Then there's the tyres on top...
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£350 should be enough to find yourself a fairly good VR6 engine
Only 24bhp more than the Valver but that engine noise :drool:
Great noise!
But with all that extra weight... :cry:
Not that much heavier.
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get a mk2 with a blown engine for £350 and fit the mk3 engine to it
job done
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Yea £350 for a good set of tyres alone!
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Not that much heavier.
Enough heavier at what? 40+ Kgs?
And forward of the driveline, not back as the 16v is...not good.
And carried high up towards the head area...not good.
There are reasons why VR6s are harder to get to handle well, comared to 16vs!
You can make a VR6 handle...but it will always understeer more than a 16v on the road...and it will involve more work and more cost to get it close to a 16v.
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Not that much heavier.
Enough heavier at what? 40+ Kgs?
And forward of the driveline, not back as the 16v is...not good.
And carried high up towards the head area...not good.
There are reasons why VR6s are harder to get to handle well, comared to 16vs!
You can make a VR6 handle...but it will always understeer more than a 16v on the road...and it will involve more work and more cost to get it close to a 16v.
Yes but the extra power and torque more than makes up for it.
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Yes but the extra power and torque more than makes up for it.
...until you come to the end of the straight and have to brake and corner the wallowy beast. More weight = more energy to control and dissipate.
A to B, it evens out... :smiley:
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However I do have to advise of my personal findings!
Had one remap and that actually reduced bhp figures! But made car more economical and more driveable.
I did the throttle body and made no difference!
I changed back from an induction kit to drilled airbox/k&n panel/cold air feed and again no difference.
Had an R-tech remap and that added 4 bhp! But increased the peak power band and improved torque slightly and smoothed out the graph so the power comes in earlier.
I have a series of Rolling Road figures to prove all this.
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Yes but the extra power and torque more than makes up for it.
...until you come to the end of the straight and have to brake and corner the wallowy beast. More weight = more energy to control and dissipate.
A to B, it evens out... :smiley:
You have your vies and I have mine, from my days at a large VW specialist / tuning company (cannot say who as Len gets upset), VR6's can be made to handle and I have driven a couple of well sorted ones.
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You have your vies and I have mine, from my days at a large VW specialist / tuning company (cannot say who as Len gets upset), VR6's can be made to handle and I have driven a couple of well sorted ones.
I agree, they sure can. I know of a few that do.
But is takes more effort and better components to get the same result, due to the additional weight and where it's carried.
The fact remains though, they will always understeer more on like-for-like set-ups.
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Yes but the extra power and torque more than makes up for it.
...until you come to the end of the straight and have to brake and corner the wallowy beast. More weight = more energy to control and dissipate.
A to B, it evens out... :smiley:
You have your vies and I have mine, from my days at a large VW specialist / tuning company (cannot say who as Len gets upset), VR6's can be made to handle and I have driven a couple of well sorted ones.
TSR was a good company, most of its life, so it dont upset me. Its just you Wayne! :tongue:
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Well I suggest you go back and read it again as none was directed at the company, just at what you TOLD me I could do to my car and guessing what my intentions are when even I dont know that yet!
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All I said with reference to TSR was were you the tea boy?
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You're learning!
Took me a while to but you must realise when its time to STF up and leave things!
Best if Shady deletes the last few posts! :wink:
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Unfortunately buying the performance parts is only a small part of the cost, you then have the costs you didn't originally realise.
For example you buy a ported head or get yours done for £450 but then you need to add a top end gasket set about £70, new headbolts £20, and new coolant etc.
You buy new cams for £400 then you need to buy some new gaskets £40 then you need new followers £5 to £10 each, or do you go for lightweight followers £250 and titanium caps £?
After each of these you would be wise to have a rolling road remap another £250 to £300.
Paul
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Unfortunately buying the performance parts is only a small part of the cost, you then have the costs you didn't originally realise.
For example you buy a ported head or get yours done for £450 but then you need to add a top end gasket set about £70, new headbolts £20, and new coolant etc.
You buy new cams for £400 then you need to buy some new gaskets £40 then you need new followers £5 to £10 each, or do you go for lightweight followers £250 and titanium caps £?
After each of these you would be wise to have a rolling road remap another £250 to £300.
Paul
So true Paul...plus:
Vernier cam pulley to get the cam-crank timing spot on...
Maybe intercam verniers to get the cam-cam timing spot on...
Assuming you fit cams worth their salt, you'll be upping the rev limit...so you'd better budget for stronger flywheel to crank bolts, as you don't want the flywheel shearing off at 7300+!
If changing the bolts...you'd be as well getting the flywheel lightened...
And whilst in there, change the clutch...