GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk3 => Topic started by: El_Presidente on 18 August 2009, 22:07
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i have a mk3 1.4 petrol, i took my air box off to fit an induction kit, i have done this on sevral cars no worries. however, when i opened the air box there was a flap and 2 intake pipes, one standard going to the front to draw cold air and then another which appears to connect to a hose drawing hot air from the exhaust manifold, i have not encountered this before and wondered why it was like this, when i start the car the flap closes of the cold feed and and seems to draw the hot air in instead. i have left the bottom half of the air box on and fitted the new filter with no performance issues, so long story short what is the purpose of it?
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To prevent fuel icing when the inlet temperature gets too low.
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ok thanks, do you think it would be wiser to go for a k&n panel filter instead then or something similar? will i get problems in the colder months?
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I would leave it standard, there's not alot of point with 1.4.
Enjoy the fuel consumption :smiley:
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same on the engine on my gfs polo.
Held together with duck tape, would just leave it as it is. And fit a new filter.
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lol thanks for the advice, ill probably look at a k&n panel filter, i know there is no real performance benefit, i just wanted a gruntier sound.
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if your desperate for an induction kit, go to a scrappy and find a golf 1.8 spi or passat 1.8spi, they use a very similar throttle body, they have a slightly different airbox configuration which will bolt straight on and allow fitment of a cone filter. A lot of polo owners fit them.
you could also fit the throttlebody to give the car a bit more go, but it does require a little tinkering to get it to run right
heres a pic of what the air filter arangement should look like, note the round air box is replaced with a setup that looks more like the type used on mpi vws
(http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa306/m_rigby/car/IMG_0366.jpg)
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hey thanks for the info, i already took the filter off and put the standard air box back on as it was crap lol, i have ordered a k&n panel filter to see what that will do, as for swapping the throttle body and air box, my throttle body already looks like the one in the picture its just the airbox that is slightly different, instead of the intake from the exhaust manifold going to the front as you have it pictured it goes to the back but its still square shape and not the early round one. would it still be of benifit getting the 1.8 throttle body with this being the case? thanks :)
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Its not just a throttle body, thats the whole fuel injection unit, the 1.8L SPI unit wont work, or it it does.. it really wont like it one bit, diffrent size throttle bodys will cause it to run like crap as the injector is made to work along side that, unlike multi point.
You can safely remove that warm air feed, i always take them off. in this climate it makes no diffrence, on a cold morning it will warm up the air a bit to help it run and not be lumpy but its just not needed, you can rip it all off to just the intake pipe and put a K&N on it, although that will make no difference to the performance, and like most people will tell you, it will suck hot air from the engine which ultimatly will make it slower. So the pannel filter is usually the best option, providing you arnt looking for that deep intake noise as the air box silences it... but saying that, the 1.4 doesnt really make any noise even with a K&N filter so... you have gone for the best option really. :smiley:
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Actually i stand corrected with the 1.8 SPI unit, the ABD engine liek yours should work ok with the AAM 1.8L engine (75bhp) but not the 90BHP engine, either would work but the 90bhp one causes it to be lumpy.
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the throttle body should work fine. ive used an 1800 butterfly assembly with a 1300 injector plate on a 1 litre polo and for what it was it flew. also done a 1300 polo with golf 1800 butterfly assy fitted with a 1400 golf injector and that also went well. granted you might need to experiment a bit, but when you can pick the bits up for peanuts, why not!
if nothing else it makes for an entertaining weekend!
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it sounds like a good idea, although i dont have in depth mechanical knowladge, i can do basics, servicing, fitting the odd bit, clutch cables, replaced the odd icv on my old calibra's body panels etc but have never really attempted anything much with throttle bodies apart from cleaning them. would this be a no no for a learner? i can follow guides etc easily
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Dont expect a 1.8 throttle body to make a 1.4 fly... as long as it has 1.4 pistons its not going to make much diffrence, i think VW probably did think through what throttle body is best for the engine when they made it, and knowing vw, if the 1.8 tb worked... they would have used that to save on parts. Seems they did that with most other things. :smiley:
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its a 1.4!! the only thing thats going to make it faster is if you scrap it and put in something bigger!
no way is it worth messing about with it, as to get it any quicker you will spend as much as it costs to get a bigger engine!
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lol im not expecting huge power increase, just to make it more responsive and maybe a little more power, however the benefit of modding a 1.4 appeals to me as my previous 2ltr was £1500 a year tpft and this 1.4 is only £700 a year fully comp due to living in a bad postcode area, so spending £200 or £300 on a few bits from a scrappy and the fun of messing with an engine is perfectly acceptable to me offset against the rediculous cost of insurance these days
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I know what you mean, i was in exactly the same boat last year. I had a 1.4 and had to resign my self to making it look better rather then be quicker. The money i saved went on my GTI which i got this summer.
Just spend wisely, there not capable of going much quicker at all
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Dont expect a 1.8 throttle body to make a 1.4 fly... as long as it has 1.4 pistons its not going to make much diffrence, i think VW probably did think through what throttle body is best for the engine when they made it, and knowing vw, if the 1.8 tb worked... they would have used that to save on parts. Seems they did that with most other things. :smiley:
thats not always the case. other factors can decide what parts on an engine are used. It wouldn't make sense for vw to make a 1.4 which had nearly the same performance as the 1.6 model. Im not saying it gonna make it fast or anything like that, but it doesnt mean that there isnt room for improvement. The ABD can be easilly tuned to put out around 120 bhp btw
Either way, anything mk3 that doesnt have a vr6 or an engine transplant such as a 1.8t is gonna nothing more than nippy no matter what.
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The ABD can be easilly tuned to put out around 120 bhp btw
i would be intrested to know what would need doing to it to produce these figures? is it something you have done yourself or just hearsay? as the response i have had on my other thread on what can be done to tune a 1.4 abd has recieved a solid " nothing " lol
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Of course a fully race tuned 1.4 can put out 120bhp but will cost a fortune, why waste your money when a bog standard 8 valve gti can match that with extra torque and better brakes etc, and will your race tuned 1.4 be cheaper on insurance not sure. :undecided:
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to get that figure you have to first rebuild the engine (new fuel injection system, uprate all the internals, pistions etc make it stronger)
then you would have to upgrade the car, better brakes etc
and i would say 120 was very optimistic from that engine
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The ABD can be easilly tuned to put out around 120 bhp btw
i would be intrested to know what would need doing to it to produce these figures? is it something you have done yourself or just hearsay? as the response i have had on my other thread on what can be done to tune a 1.4 abd has recieved a solid " nothing " lol
polo gt digifant multi point injection fitted with poloace remapped chip, ported throttle body, schrick 268 cam + ported head, golf gti airflow meter, 4 branch exhaust and good quality exhaust. It might not produce exactly 120 bhp, but it wont be far off.
Loads of polo owners use the ADB block to gain extra torque from their polo gts.
A similar build can be done using the 1.6 AEE, main thing this will gain is a bit more bhp and extra torque, though it is a less revvy engine and the dont take as much abuse
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Of course a fully race tuned 1.4 can put out 120bhp but will cost a fortune, why waste your money when a bog standard 8 valve gti can match that with extra torque and better brakes etc, and will your race tuned 1.4 be cheaper on insurance not sure. :undecided:
is this based on fact or just what you have read? an 8 valve gti is hardly fast, my polo gt would give it a run for its money, and my g40 would blow it clean out of the water. (the reason i know this, is that ive also got a mk3 golf fitted with the 2 litre 8v gti engine)
tuning the small bore vw engines is far more common than a majority of blinkered golf owners appear to realise!
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as I always say, why build something that is already there?
Why tune a 1.4? its rivals will be corsa SXI and saxo VTS.....Now, if you tune a gti 16v or a VR6, then its rivals will be cars that are actually worth competing against. Tuning a small engine like that is pointless mate, don't bother wasting ANY money on it.
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^ you could use that reason for anything, why buy a golf and tune it, when the total amount spent could have bought you a better car in the 1st place!?
would i bother spending a small fortune tuning my polo g40?
of course i wouldnt. it would be pointless, for the cost i could have just gone out and done the logical thing a bought a raddo g60 instead.
to many engine tuners a 2 litre is a small engine, and therfore by your own admission would be pointless to tune!
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yes but I'm talking within VW world. Of course if you spent what some people have spent on their cars you could buy a BMW or merc, or even better :smiley:
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the point im trying to make is that there are things worth doing that dont cost a fortune to do, yet do make a big difference to a cars performance. a classic example would be of the g60, where people fit a smaller pulley and uprated ecu chip. costs naf all and give a good gain.
i wasnt saying the guy with the abd should go the whole hog with tuning it. I was merely stating that the engine is capable of producing suprising power figures.
Someone suggested dropping the ABU or AEE block in instead. Why bother? its only 15bhp up on the ABD now that really would be a wasted effort when you could get 15 bhp more out of the abd for a lot less work
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Of course a fully race tuned 1.4 can put out 120bhp but will cost a fortune, why waste your money when a bog standard 8 valve gti can match that with extra torque and better brakes etc, and will your race tuned 1.4 be cheaper on insurance not sure. :undecided:
is this based on fact or just what you have read? an 8 valve gti is hardly fast, my polo gt would give it a run for its money, and my g40 would blow it clean out of the water. (the reason i know this, is that ive also got a mk3 golf fitted with the 2 litre 8v gti engine)
tuning the small bore vw engines is far more common than a majority of blinkered golf owners appear to realise!
Your talking rubbish mate a polo is only half the weight of a mk3 golf the o/p was talking about tuning a 1.4 mk3 not a polo which is why we advise against and a standard 8 valve will be faster than a tuned 1.4 as it has more torque. Stick a 2e lump in you little polo and see how fast it is.
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a polo weighs around 850kg, a mk3 golf weighs 1100 kg, so the difference in weight is a couple of fat people. a 1400 abd tuned the the spec i listed will put out in excess of 100 lb/foot of torque, which correct me if im wrong, isnt that far off std 2L 8v torque figures.
If you had bothered to read the whole thread rather than throwing your toys out of the pram, you would have read that I was not advising the person who started the thread to go out and do any of this stuff. He asked how the 120 bhp was achieved from an abd and I told him, nothing more, nothing less. You could probably apply similar tuning tecniques to the 2L 8V, but it would be pointless, as you would struggle to exceed std 16v power, same could be said of the 16v when compared with the vr6 too. if your gonna spend big money tuning, you might aswell use the best engine offered in the chosen model.
The 2e or any other tall block for that matter won't fit in a polo, without spending 2k on a subframe, even then it wont be any quicker than a std g40 and it certainly won't handle any better, due to all that extra weight up front.
heres what my stock polo g40 put out a few months back
(http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q233/g40jon/rollinroadg40.jpg)
7bhp and 9 lb/foot more than a std 2 litre 8v
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They power figures that could be anything, if you read my orininal thread I did concede that 120bhp was possible with a full race tune, but really expensive and not drivable off the track, I still dispute whether you will get the same torque as a 2.0L and in a mk3 because of the weight I would rather start with at least a 2.0L with the exception of a 1.8T as the 2.0L is tunable and the 1.4 quite frankly is ok for going to Tescos.
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The ABD engine produces 60bhp as standard.
Is it just me that thinks getting 120bhp out of that lump is not possible without some form of forced induction?
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The ABD engine produces 60bhp as standard.
Is it just me that thinks getting 120bhp out of that lump is not possible without some form of forced induction?
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its just crazy even thinking about it. For the money it takes you to do it (if it is possible) could be put towards buying and insuring with money left over a GTI that has all the power standard, thats not going to prematurely wear out other parts because of the extra stresses
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+2