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Model specific boards => Golf mk3 => Topic started by: Len on 10 June 2009, 13:46

Title: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 13:46
had MOT test today (early) and failed badly on emissions!

CO2 readings very high, nearly double what they should be!
So the K&N will be going back on!
Spoke to Nick at RTech so can swap the old chip back in.

But my questions are what if this doesnt make it read right? What else should I be looking at?

Oxygen(lambda) sensor was changed a couple of years ago as was the CAT.
What other sensors could affect it?
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Horney on 10 June 2009, 13:47
Lambda would be the likely culprit. Did you fit gen or GSF cheapie? I've heard that the cheaper ones really don't last long.

Nick
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Petec82 on 10 June 2009, 13:56
If there is a leak in the exhaust it can make the co2 emmisions rocket sometimes! Try checking if there are any tiny leaks the MOT gut didnt pick up on. If not either the Lambda or Cat I wouldve thought!
Pete
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Khare on 10 June 2009, 14:24
doubt the chip would make that much difference, many chipped cars still pass the emmisions test.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 14:29
Lambda would be the likely culprit. Did you fit gen or GSF cheapie? I've heard that the cheaper ones really don't last long.

Nick

Was a GSF one!  :sad:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 14:30
If there is a leak in the exhaust it can make the co2 emmisions rocket sometimes! Try checking if there are any tiny leaks the MOT gut didnt pick up on. If not either the Lambda or Cat I wouldve thought!
Pete

Cant see or hear any leaks!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: JC on 10 June 2009, 14:31
poorly maintained car  :huh: :undecided: :lipsrsealed:







and sits











and waits

 :grin:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 14:32
 :tongue:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 14:33
Gonna change the chip over as I know the other one was more economical so this new one is possibly over fueling!

Oh and Chuff didnt you notice my pics of the very shiny throttle body?
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: JC on 10 June 2009, 14:34
when were your plugs changed last ?
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Paul86S2 on 10 June 2009, 14:51
Len

Was the car warmed up properly before the MOT test? A cold car can give incorrect readings.

Have a look at the following link - may be useful

http://www.petercoopercarrepairs.co.uk/new_page_3.htm (http://www.petercoopercarrepairs.co.uk/new_page_3.htm)

Paul

Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 14:54
Oh yes the car was well warm and the tester gave it lots of revving and running!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 14:59
Yea thanks for that Paul, interesting reading!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 15:00
when were your plugs changed last ?



Ummmmmm........

Worth a check I suppose!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Khare on 10 June 2009, 15:01
Oh yes the car was well warm and the tester gave it lots of revving and running!

ok, well check the wallet for £20 and offer them to the tester next time, should pass with flying colours  :laugh:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: davero on 10 June 2009, 15:51
Pretty sure you will have checked this, but check your map sensor hose for leaks( the one from
the T.b. to the ecu ). This caused my emmissions to skyrocket on my old 16v
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 16:11
Yea will do, that pipe needs replacing anyway coz it was bodged before!
The tester guy did suggest checking all breather hoses!

Plugs are fine! No nasty deposits! Likewise the dizzy cap and rotor arm.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: AudiA8Quattro on 10 June 2009, 16:16
Try some cataclean, i've used it to get old single point injection polo's through the test.
You can buy it from GSF.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 16:22
Here are the actual figures:-

Fast Idle 2500 - 2850 rpm
CO = .58% should be 0.3%

Natural Idle 725 - 925 rpm
 0.68% should be 0.5%

He did a Second Fast Idle test and the was worse at 0.63% But the HC came down from 71ppm to 45ppm.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: AudiA8Quattro on 10 June 2009, 16:23
Have you failed on hc as well?
Are you burning oil?
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 16:25
No HC is well below would it could be! Max is 200ppm.

And no not burning much oil as shown by how good a state the plugs are in!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Khare on 10 June 2009, 16:32
No HC is well below would it could be! Max is 200ppm.

And no not burning much oil as shown by how good a state the plugs are in!
well i hope not!  :grin:

Black plugs = running rich
glazed over, very white cores = running lean.

It should have grey/brown deposits.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 16:33
No HC is well below would it could be! Max is 200ppm.

And no not burning much oil as shown by how good a state the plugs are in!
well i hope not!  :grin:

Black plugs = running rich
glazed over, very white cores = running lean.

It should have grey/brown deposits.


Exactly what they all are! Yes I checked all 4!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: AudiA8Quattro on 10 June 2009, 16:34
Have you tried VAG com?
I would put my money on the lambda probe. Put a new one in.
Run the car down to about a quarter of tank of gas, put the cataclean in it, then take it for a long run up the motorway. Then refill with some super unleaded.
That will solve your problem  :smiley:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Khare on 10 June 2009, 16:37
Pretty sure you will have checked this, but check your map sensor hose for leaks( the one from
the T.b. to the ecu ). This caused my emmissions to skyrocket on my old 16v

Yea will do, that pipe needs replacing anyway coz it was bodged before!

Try the pipe then, dont bother taking the car apart just to find the problem was the pipe.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 16:38
Have you tried VAG com?


No not yet - checking on here first to get views and info. :wink:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 16:38
Again why I'm asking on here first to save myself work!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Khare on 10 June 2009, 16:39
pipe pipe pipe! Get working Len!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 10 June 2009, 16:42
pipe pipe pipe! Get working Len!

Yea , yea!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: spunkymonkey on 10 June 2009, 22:02
To be fair it wouldnt matter what chip your running the cat should sort the emmisions. If it was over fuelling that badly the plugs would be black as coal. I would get some cat treatment and take it for a damn good leathering round some B roads then a few miles on the motorway in a low gear keeping the revs high (4.5-5k). Its suprising the results.

Ive been an MOT tester for 10yrs and additive has come along in leaps and bounds.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 11 June 2009, 09:47
Yea been thinking the same! As the plugs are clean its not overfueling so must be either the CAT or lambda.

Yea I'm gonna read that info Paul gave again then go get some CAT cleaner!
Then a few blasts on M4 and A419! :evil: :laugh:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Khare on 11 June 2009, 10:05
Yea been thinking the same! As the plugs are clean its not overfueling so must be either the CAT or lambda.

Yea I'm gonna read that info Paul gave again then go get some CAT cleaner!
Then a few blasts on M4 and A419! :evil: :laugh:

or the pipe, remember?
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: danny_p on 11 June 2009, 16:35
sort the vac pipes if in any dought  and give it a good italian tune up.   the abf in my mk2 got that treatment  and ti managed better on the emission test without a cat
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 11 June 2009, 19:57
Well Khare bear replacing that pipe has revealed other problems! :angry:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Khare on 11 June 2009, 19:59
Well Khare bear replacing that pipe has revealed other problems! :angry:

 :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:  :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:   :lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed:

like what?
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 11 June 2009, 20:32
See other tread on Hunting/Idle!

My guess is either something has just broke or by replacing the vac pies it has shown up something else that wasnt working! A sensor maybe
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Adam on 11 June 2009, 21:14
blame Khare..........
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 12 June 2009, 08:18
Oh I have been cursing him dont worry!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: christomk3gti on 12 June 2009, 14:37
lol Have u knocked something when u was messing around in your engine bay. (or get it professionally repaired and send khare the bill)

 :grin:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 12 June 2009, 20:10
Well the other problem is solved, but still got same emissions readings!

Did the cataclean stuff and gave it a good rant and took it to a mate of a mates place and stuck it on the tester and got exactly the same readings!

So consensus now is its the CAT!

Advised to change crankcase breather and check Dizzy cap and rotor again as there is a slight hesitation and will check test again before I buy a CAT!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: AudiA8Quattro on 12 June 2009, 23:55
I would change the lambda probe too.
If the cat is only a couple of years old, like you said, then something has f**ked it.
The probe is probably the likely cause.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 13 June 2009, 17:40
Possibly, but surely if the engine is running correctly as proved by the combustion colours on the plugs then the oxygen sensor must be doing its job?
Isnt it only there to change the air/fuel mixture as its before the CAT.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 14 June 2009, 16:15
Ummmmm been tinkering today with that crankcase breather and checking the dizzy cap fully and well I noticed a warning note on the cross beam by the bonnet catch! This says -  Waring! overfilling with oil will damage the CAT!

 :embarassed:

ooooops!

I have done that a few times!
Not by a great deal but could give an inkling why that crankcase breather burst! Hmmmmmm
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: thai-wronghorse on 14 June 2009, 17:32
Sounds like your problem them matey. A lot of people don't realise that an over oil filled engine can be just as detrimental to it's health as a dry running one due to the extra oil pressure build up.
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 14 June 2009, 17:43
Well have managed to get the CAT off after busting a bolt and by using loads of WD40!

Looks very black in there!  :sad:
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: thai-wronghorse on 14 June 2009, 17:45
Black as in cooked oil?
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 15 June 2009, 16:36
Yes!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: thai-wronghorse on 15 June 2009, 22:09
Oops!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Khare on 15 June 2009, 22:38
well it will be black! its were most of the soot from the engine goes!!!!
Title: Re: Emmisions Fail!
Post by: Len on 17 June 2009, 10:38
Sticky black!


Anyway all is good now!
Had codes read and no faults AND its passed its MOT.

So was the CAT!
Emissions test also showed that lambda maybe a little suspect too! Marginally over!





So Nick/Ben (RTech) was nowt to do with the remap! Realised that after checking the plugs and thinking sensibly instead of in a panic!  :rolleyes: :laugh: