GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk2 => Topic started by: danny_p on 09 June 2009, 13:07
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fed up with playing with eproms now. so started making the adaptor loom to plumb it into the engine loom aim will be to get the ITB's installed as soon as it has run resonable on the std manifold
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Which engine are you using and what diameter TB's are you using out of interest?
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2.0 16v ABF. will be running it up on std manifold and tb to start with, then i'm going to 42mm throttel bodies of a gsxr 1000
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Good stuff :afro:
I've been making lots of megasquirt related plans in my head lately, this could help.
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I will be watching this thread very closely - it's exactly what I plan to do in the next year or two. :smiley: Just starting to gather information now... I'm sure you'll be a big help :)
Will you also be using megasquirt to run the ignition? Dizzy or dizzyless?
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Sweet, Im doing similar at the moment (Very slowly!) running ZX12 TB's (taper from about 47mm down to 42mm which suits the intake port area rather nicely and only 2mm out on the cylinder spacing) with some mild cams and a V3 board on MS II. Just in the middle of making the manifold and trumpets, finishing the engine build and finalising the board build (still cant decide which ignition to use lol) sorting out which fuel pump to use etc etc etc etc! Will be good to see how you get on.
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will be doing fuel and spark ,the dizzy will stay for a bit just to route sparks with but allready have the hardware mods to the me done for two spark output channels, so once running will be changeing the settings and swaping over to wasted spark useing ether a ford edis coil pack driven by two vag coil drivers ( to keep ignition current out of the ecu ) or more likely a coil on plug setup proably useing vag coilpacks for cuteness.
my tbs also taper down to. will be intergarteing wide band lambda control and once have sorted a desing for a knock prossor i'll add dual knock pickups as well.
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few piccys of the throttel bodies
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/16v%20head%20strip/16vheadthrottelbodies2.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/16v%20head%20strip/16vheadthrottelbodies.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/16v%20head%20strip/16vheadthrottelbodies3.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/16v%20head%20strip/16vheadmanifold2.jpg)
they were done some time ago
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where are you running the injectors? bodies or manifold? or all 8 :laugh:
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i'm going to block the ports in the manifold to start with the bike injectors in theory are 230cc/min @45 psi that isn't really enough but if it run them @ 60 psi they should be fine. the bike injectors are the one to use out of preferance i think as they react very fast and mist fuel very finely whitch helps a TB'ed engine idel better.
the plan for the other 4 injectors by the head is there is an airway lin the manifold linking them, this looks most usefull for fittting an ISV to, so for startup and idel i shoudl be abel to have the throttels shut and use this airway meaning a high idel vaccume should be maintaned and i'll have plenty of control over idel speed during the warm up cycle.
the other 4 injectors will get used at some point
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todays progress
finished makeing adaptor loom from MS to a digi 3 connector, pluged it in turned key, poked it with laptop turned key again, and it went brum yay.
unpluged the ms plugged digi 3 back in went back in house
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more details will follow and some piccys and possobly vids of it running, but cant really be arsed tuneing it with the std manifold so till the ITBS have worked there way back
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good stuff.
where did you read up on the tuning side of things? i need to start reading up on it all. im gonna have a go at bike itb's and megasquirt maybe next year, depending on how long the shell takes to finish
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din't reall read up on tuneing in particular place. i read a bit of theory and messed anotu with a few engines then read a bit more theory then had the piss taken out of my attemps and given tips by people that have done a lot more tuneing then started comapareing what thay did to what i did and trying to work out why. but what i have found out with pissing abou with ecu's is
tuneing fuel is easy , very easy with a wideband lambda, spark is where the power and the risk is ifor the sparck tabels on mine i plan to get it close ish then i'll take it to a rolling road and have it tweeked there, as more advance dose not mean more power tomuch retard or advance just mean things get to hot
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it sounds like one of those things where you have to get stuck in and learn as you go really. should be fun though! the wiring and installing sensors etc looks easy enough
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its very easy on the abf ALL the sensors you need are allready there and they are all compatable with ms. hence why i kept the digifant 3 loom
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how easy is it to get running ??
i am a mechanic with quite a lot of electrics experiance but a bit nervous about starting this
is it a complete ECU build or do you buy it from somewhere ???
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Ecu came in kit form, built a few of them now, if i build any more of them i won't be buying kits tho i'l get the boards and prossesors from B&G and source the componets myself, i'll put some build photos of another ecu up that i'm building thats most likely destined for tc's car. but my ms bild is not exactly standard as i've added in a few of the optinal extras .
tbh assenbeling the ecu is pritty easy if you have a decent solering iron, the biggest recuring problem i've found is the bloody laptop no speacking to the MS, vista + usb adaptor can piss you around for hours on end sometimes for no apparent reason :angry:
apart from that if it's all wired right once the basic setting are dialed in right it'll go.
some old photos
ms2 pcb v3, prosessor not installed, with high current PWM idel driver for VAG ISV
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/megasquirt/100_0646.jpg)
same one boxed up afetr been tested on the stim now been tested with the stim and some of the actual components (the tbs and isv )
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/megasquirt/itworking.jpg)
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What ignition are you running? Ive set mine up for edis (built it last year for my own car but never found the budget lol) and am thinking of dual coil setup now to keep things sorta simple (the cars owner refuses to use Ford parts lol). Other than that im finished but since the bottom ends been balanced I dont want to go adding a 36-1 sensor wheel to the crank and I dont want to go near a stock distributer.
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I'll be running my 1.8t on a variant of megasquirt, should be arriving next week :)
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thread cleaned, carry on :smiley:
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The argument Vaughn's so helpfully cleaned off of here is the suggestion that the standard ABF triggerwheel can fail.
There is a thread on another forum where this has happened, but this was revving the motor to 8650RPM, so this is an issue those on here are unlikely to bump into, unless we start investing in built engines and take the rev limit a long way up from standard. The standard triggerwheel should be fine, especially on motors that haven't had the bottom end opened up and interfered with since they left the factory.
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ok thats good to hear :) dought theres any power to be had past 8000 rpm without spending serious money on cams, serious headwork and solid lifter conversion.
ignition wise i don't think there is any need for EDIS MS 2 can have spark outputs, to get it running id would sugest useing singel coil if it's allready there as it makes things easyer, but to convert to wasted spark you'll need to have a look at the megamaual and lookup the 2nd ignition output, i would fit a high current driver to both of them just because they are more robust. but i also think driveing ignition coil directly with the ecu is a bad idea even tho ms is desinged to cope it dosent take much effort to use remote coil drivers and it keeps about 14 amps out the ecu. two vag coil drivers and an EDIS coil pack or any other wasted spark coil pack will do ( vw were even useing one at one point on some 8v i saw in the scrappy ) or just connect the output to the singnal line of 1.8T coil packs and have coil on plug running in a wasted spark
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OT- LMFAO!
Back on topic though, fair point on keeping the current out of the ECU. Meh, bloody hate trawling through all of the options on Megasquirt and the various ways of doing it all lol.
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ok useing the high current driver to trigger extrenal ignition amps is a bit ott but there is reason for it. cars are very harsh enviroment for electronics and there less than 30p .
also coil packs can kick back downt he trigger line if they have a bad eath the transistor on the end of the trigger line dosent like that, track cars tend to have there engine poked with sticks rather more often than dailys so in the event of a ground been left off the high current driver is much less likely to pop and even if it dose it can be jumperd past in a few moments without any spectial tools ( if you installed jumpers instead of links ) so you can continue to play one orginal fault fixed.
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the MS - DIGIFANT 3 plug and play prototype loom.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/102_1942.jpg)
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I'm now pretty certain I'm going down the Megasquirt route as the ECU company I was waiting months for have really pissed me off today. Did you get your ECU from the UK or did you get it from the states. I have added all the bits and pieces I want to my "cart" on DIYautotune who seem to have a good reputation. The 1.8T megasquirt starts soon so will stick a thread up when I get going. :)
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last 4 megasquirts have come from DIY AUTOTUNE, there is soposed to be a uk distubutor i tryed to get hold of and failed so orderd off diy autotune and fount them optimal. tho any more meagasquirts i do won't be bought in kit form i'm in the prosess of priceing up the componets from rapid and i'll just buy the boards and cpu, think i have also found a more optimal case ( for my needs anyway as i can get two knock prossesor boards and a wideband lambda controller int he same case hopefully :) ) just need a more reliable job then i can spend more on the toys
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Hmm do you have msn? might want to pick your brains briefly before I jump in with both feet. :) kez_97@hotmail.com :nerd:
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My brain hurts :D
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He does that.
To be fair, you did ask for it.
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He does that.
To be fair, you did ask for it.
I know :D He's been really helpful though answered loads of my N00b questions and set me on the right path, sorted now though and my MS is been built as I type in the good ol' US of A for me by the guys at DIYautotune. Looking forward to playing around and hopefully getting my car running soon :)