GolfGTIforum.co.uk
General => General discussion => Topic started by: Horney on 07 May 2009, 15:14
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Been going to a lot of motorsport events recently and I really want to get out on track in something or other.
I have the camper sat outside the flat and it never gets used but costs me £700 a year on tax and insurance etc.
So what do you guys think I should do? Keep the camper or sell it and get myself a MKII Gti to track?
Nick
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Track car all the way, but then I am biased and love racing. In all seriousness though if you don't use the camper then swap it for something you can get use out of.
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Track car all the way, but then I am biased and love racing. In all seriousness though if you don't use the camper then swap it for something you can get use out of.
yeh agree with what he said
get a track toy
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Yeah that's my thinking but it's a tough one. Spent a lot of time and money on the camper and we went on honeymoon in it so it has alot of sentimental value. I also think if I get it working properly and repainted I'll feel the love for it again.
Wish I had enough money to keep it and get a track car. It evenhas a tow hook so I could a-frame a track car with it!
nick
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If you reckon you'll use a track focussed car more often than the camper then get the track car. Why ask the question? its common sense lad!
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Why ask the question? its common sense lad!
See above re: honeymoon etc. The wife while contributing nothing to it's running costs still kinda has a say as it's a part of our wedding in many ways.
Nick
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easy.
get the camper on the track
done.
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Track cars aren't cheap though! Why not take the Rado on track?
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Why ask the question? its common sense lad!
See above re: honeymoon etc. The wife while contributing nothing to it's running costs still kinda has a say as it's a part of our wedding in many ways.
Nick
Buy her some new Oven Gloves with a pic of the camper on. She will always be close to it then :lipsrsealed: :grin:
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Track cars aren't cheap though! Why not take the Rado on track?
Cause it also needs to get me the 21 miles to work everyday. Trackcar and daily driver are not a good combo. I should know as my mini used to do both, it was wicked on track but horrible as a daily and then I only commuted 7 miles a day!
Campervan on track would be amasing but might require an engine upgrade from the smoker that's in it now. It barely does 70!
Nick
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Why ask the question? its common sense lad!
See above re: honeymoon etc. The wife while contributing nothing to it's running costs still kinda has a say as it's a part of our wedding in many ways.
Nick
Buy her some new Oven Gloves with a pic of the camper on. She will always be close to it then :lipsrsealed: :grin:
She don't cook mate, that's my job. Would have to be a rolling mat or weed tin with the camper on it. Ha ha ha ha.
nick
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£700 to insure and tax the camper, but surely a track car wouldn't cost much less than that? You;ve then got to factor in the best part of £150-200 per event (don't know the actual prices, just a rough guess).
I reckon getting rid of the camper is something you'll regret, even more so when you don't get to as many track days as you had hoped/it all gets a bit too expensive :wink:
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£700 to insure and tax the camper, but surely a track car wouldn't cost much less than that? You;ve then got to factor in the best part of £150-200 per event (don't know the actual prices, just a rough guess).
I reckon getting rid of the camper is something you'll regret, even more so when you don't get to as many track days as you had hoped/it all gets a bit too expensive :wink:
I see your point but I'd go 2's up with my Dad on entry to the majority of events (probably should have put that in the first post!). I just pay for the car, insurance and tax. Which will be the same as the van pretty much.
Nick
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Surprised at the voting so far to be honest!
nick
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Was a narrow choice! But just plumped for the track car as it will give more fun!
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long time dead mate - sad view but tis true, wanna swap :grin:
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Your car's too good to track mate and worth more than my camper I'd have thought.
nick
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mate
in all the time I have known you I know of the camper being used once.. that was to drive to the MOT station and back
you obviously love the track events and want to get into it a lot more... and the camper isn't getting the love it should have otherwise you'd have been tinkering with it a lot more, and as you said it needs work doing to it - i can see it turning into a shed
getting a car fully prepped for the track will be an achievement, you'll have an end goal and then when you are racing you can aim higher and higher
i'd say opt for the track car, will keep you focused and also give you a nice excuse for father/son bonding
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Your car's too good to track mate and worth more than my camper I'd have thought.
nick
i meant the polo :grin:
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Yea there might be a bit of interest in that Camper of yours Nick! :wink:
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Track car for deffo man. After driving my mates Mk2 ABF, it made me want one too!
Its currently putting out 150bhp at the wheels (and 150bhp at the wheels per tonne!) and will pretty much eat anything on the road :smiley: Also great fun on the track!
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Oh dear, just had a massive argument with Lizzie over this. Despite the fact we never use it and pay for everything I am selfish and ignorant to sell something that is both of ours so I can razz a car round a track. Decided it probably wasn't best to bring up the fact I sold my last track car to pay for our deposit on our flat for the sake of keeping the peace.
Anyhoo upshot is I think it's a goer but I've had to compromise by paying for a week in cornwall and getting the bathroom re plastered and tiled. Kinds halves my track car budget but better than nothing!
Current plan is a stripped out standard 8v MKII to start with and go from there. Probably do a couple or 3 proper track days and probably a few sprints time trials etc which are much cheaper. As it'll be road legal and fully insured/taxed it'll also make a useful second car for when the corrado invariably goes wrong.
nick
Nick
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Sounds like a good start mate :)
16v ABF engines can be had for around £150 though and are relatively (1day) easy to fit :)
This is my mates one: Was running low 15's at Spring fest :smiley:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/walshy200sx/track%20car/10032009438.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/walshy200sx/track%20car/10032009437.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/walshy200sx/track%20car/18032009447.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/walshy200sx/track%20car/18032009449.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/walshy200sx/track%20car/18032009453.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/walshy200sx/track%20car/18032009450.jpg)
You know you want a little bit of mk3 in your mk2 ;)
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v315/walshy200sx/track%20car/?action=view¤t=golfdyno.flv
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oopsy about the campervan argument
looking forward to you scaring the sh1t outta me in the mk2 though! :laugh:
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you know what i think :grin:
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As someone who's made this decision about two years ago I can appreciate just how torn you are. VW Made it a lot easier for me, by obsoleting the T25 Syncro gearbox parts (among others) and the Government pushed me right over by shutting down 75% of off road tracks with the NERCa at the end of 2006.
That probably doesn't make things a lot easier for you, does it......
We sold the T4 after we had kids, we weren't using it and it was costing and rotting. I was using it to tow the Golf to track events, on an A-frame, but there was a change in the legality of using an A-frame a little while back. If the unbraked trailer/car you're towing is over 750kg *actual* weight then there's no arguing, you're busted - auto-conviction and points and fines. This means you aren't able to legally drag your Golf to a track, even if it's stripped out - it WILL weigh over 750kg.
You've run a track car before, so you know a bit about the costs, but I would caution you to not under estimate both how much you'll have to spend on the car and how much you'll want to spend on it. Doing things PROPERLY to a track car costs A LOT - wanna fit harnesses? (Not like in the one above) Then you need proper buckets, harness bars to fit the straps to, so a cage, and then the actual harnesses - £300 for 5/6 point harnesses, £500 for the cage, plus bars, £300+ for the buckets.
Unless you've got somewhere dry to store it there is the danger of things rotting and failing through lack of use, just like on your camper.
Flog the camper and have some dirty track fun, get a camper again if/when you have kids.
I know we're desparate to get a camper again, both for cheap time out (which you're a fool for not doing in the past two years) and also as a 'team vehicle' for track day events - a T5 4Motion camper will tow the trailer so much better than the Passat and provide somewhere to make tea at track days, AS WELL as providing somewhere to be dry and comfy at the 'ring.
Whatever you do, budget carefully and make sure you get plenty of use out of it. Good luck and I hope you can keep Lizzie happy, whatever the decision. There is no right decision here. :sad:
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Cheers for that DH.
Nick
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wise words from DH as usual... you were talking about decent cages the other day weren't you nick
its such a shame you have to sacrifice one for the other
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dh explain the snidy 'not like in the one above' remark
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I think he was refering to the fact the harnesses are mounted too low at the rear (not sure how strong the area is they are bolted to either).
Campervan is already sold!!!!!!!
nick
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sorry, im used to him making petty remarks about my car/opinion. thought it was another dig :rolleyes:
dont be scared by those prices though, just be patient and wait for decent second hand stuff to come up. eg the seat in mine cost me £75 and is from a fia gt car and cost in excess of £1000 when new :shocked:
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Yer my mates harnesses choke you to death under hard braking :lipsrsealed:
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campers are ghey - stay in hotels.
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dh explain the snidy 'not like in the one above' remark
Go read your MSA Blue Book about harnesses, joy boy.
Can't fix 'em to any of the seatbelt mounts - very poor practice and unsafe. Either off-centre, or way too low - spine compression ain't a good look.
2", four-point harnesses are a complete waste of time, too - broken collarbones on impact anyone?
Gotta do the lot - cage, 5/6 harnesses and buckets, or don't bother. That's why it's taken me many months to get to the point of ordering a proper cage (soon as the MG leaves my place).
Tracks also show up worn bearings and bushes and also accelerate their demise a lot faster than in a road car - there's always jobs to do.
Once you've fitted a cage, you need to wear a helmet in the car at all times, due to the proximity of the cage to your un-lidded head - road car FAILage at that point.
You'd be better off getting an MX-5, unless you're nailed-on to VWs - more RWD fun.
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While I don't have actual track experience like some people on here I do know of people who run track cars and there is alot of difference between stripping out a mk2 and using it on the track, to actually building a proper track car. As DH said, I think you'll be surprised at how much it costs to make a basic car.
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I think he was refering to the fact the harnesses are mounted too low at the rear (not sure how strong the area is they are bolted to either).
Campervan is already sold!!!!!!!
nick
already??!! blimey that was quick!!! :laugh:
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While I don't have actual track experience like some people on here I do know of people who run track cars and there is alot of difference between stripping out a mk2 and using it on the track, to actually building a proper track car. As DH said, I think you'll be surprised at how much it costs to make a basic car.
I wouldn't be surprised, probably more sickened, ha ha.
I used to track my old old mini so I do know a bit about it and I'm not going into it blind. A full blown track ready GTI would be awesome but I know that I can't afford to buy one ready done or to build one from scratch straight away.
The idea is to run a pretty standard stripped out car to start with on things like Castle Combe Action Days and at local Sprint and 12 car rallies with Lizzie and my Dad. As long as the car is in good mechanical order and I keep on top of brakes, bushes and bearings this should provide plenty of fun to start of with. Sure it won't be super fast or handle super sweet but it gets me to a few track days etc without me having to use the Rado which I love too much to put on track.
If over the course of this year I find both myself and Lizzie and my Dad get really into it then we can look at upgrading the car into a full blown track slag over the winter and split the costs between us.
Like I said above I'm only initially going to be doing the more RWYB kinda days and I'm under no illusions that a basic stripped out car isn't going to set the world alight. I do know however, that it's a step in the direction and away from sitting next to circuits with my camera longing to be out there. If I had the money I'd be runing in the GTI Champ, but I don't so this will have to do.
Nick
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You don't have to race to have fun.
Racing's when things start to get properly expensive.
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While I don't have actual track experience like some people on here I do know of people who run track cars and there is alot of difference between stripping out a mk2 and using it on the track, to actually building a proper track car. As DH said, I think you'll be surprised at how much it costs to make a basic car.
I wouldn't be surprised, probably more sickened, ha ha.
I used to track my old old mini so I do know a bit about it and I'm not going into it blind. A full blown track ready GTI would be awesome but I know that I can't afford to buy one ready done or to build one from scratch straight away.
The idea is to run a pretty standard stripped out car to start with on things like Castle Combe Action Days and at local Sprint and 12 car rallies with Lizzie and my Dad. As long as the car is in good mechanical order and I keep on top of brakes, bushes and bearings this should provide plenty of fun to start of with. Sure it won't be super fast or handle super sweet but it gets me to a few track days etc without me having to use the Rado which I love too much to put on track.
If over the course of this year I find both myself and Lizzie and my Dad get really into it then we can look at upgrading the car into a full blown track slag over the winter and split the costs between us.
Like I said above I'm only initially going to be doing the more RWYB kinda days and I'm under no illusions that a basic stripped out car isn't going to set the world alight. I do know however, that it's a step in the direction and away from sitting next to circuits with my camera longing to be out there. If I had the money I'd be runing in the GTI Champ, but I don't so this will have to do.
Nick
and good on ya I say . :afro:
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You don't have to race to have fun.
Racing's when things start to get properly expensive.
Exact a mundo. I just want to be able to enjoy getting out on track and going to sprint meets in a car that I don't have to rely on to get to work the following week.
Nick
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You know the score, but as long as you start with a good base car, set out a plan, you can gradually build it up over the years and turn it into a proper monster.
Goes without saying that as long as the engine is serviced and in reasonable shape you work on the brakes and suspension setup first and take it from there. I miss my race car loads, so I envy you getting back out there.
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You may as well get a 16v to start off with, rather than an 8v.
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You may as well get a 16v to start off with, rather than an 8v.
Not really no. a 16v in my budget will be hanging and probably thrashed to death. Would rather pick up an 8v and then drop an ABF in there at a later date.
nick
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track raddo, you know it makes sense!
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track raddo, you know it makes sense!
Would be nice but not using my current one, gutted I missed that free G60!
nick
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you can have my not free g60 lol
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the raddos far too nice to track tbh
by the way i hope you like it as it is cos your wont be spending any money on it after you get the mk2 :grin:
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You may as well get a 16v to start off with, rather than an 8v.
Not really no. a 16v in my budget will be hanging and probably thrashed to death. Would rather pick up an 8v and then drop an ABF in there at a later date.
nick
whats your budget :lipsrsealed:
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You may as well get a 16v to start off with, rather than an 8v.
Not really no. a 16v in my budget will be hanging and probably thrashed to death. Would rather pick up an 8v and then drop an ABF in there at a later date.
nick
whats your budget :lipsrsealed:
Can't track your car its too nice
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not mine big boy - :wink: and looks are deceptive anyway :grin:
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You may as well get a 16v to start off with, rather than an 8v.
Not really no. a 16v in my budget will be hanging and probably thrashed to death. Would rather pick up an 8v and then drop an ABF in there at a later date.
nick
whats your budget :lipsrsealed:
I've just looked at mk2 prices :shocked:
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+1 with the man above - you considered a (pains me to say it ) mk3 nick - a LOT cheaper than 2's at the mo - and its getting gutted anyway :wink:
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Just to think I sold my red 8v Big bumpered for under £400!
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+1 with the man above - you considered a (pains me to say it ) mk3 nick - a LOT cheaper than 2's at the mo - and its getting gutted anyway :wink:
I want to do track days not land sailing!
But in all honesty it has crossed my mind that a MKIII 16v could be snuck in on budget.
Nick
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+1 with the man above - you considered a (pains me to say it ) mk3 nick - a LOT cheaper than 2's at the mo - and its getting gutted anyway :wink:
I want to do track days not land sailing!
But in all honesty it has crossed my mind that a MKIII 16v could be snuck in on budget.
Nick
:afro: - theres been a couple on here of late :wink: 3's that is :grin:
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3 power!!!!!! :laugh:
not available in 8v form
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tbh a hatchback is a hatchback when its track prepared, might be a 50kg difference but thats it. you just wont be as cool!
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http://search.autotrader.co.uk/es-uk/www/cars/VOLKSWAGEN+GOLF/Ne-2-4-5-6-7-8-27-44-49-53-61-64-67-103-133-146-236,N-12-29-240-4294966835-4294966886/advert.action?R=200918333593235&distance=71&postcode=ox106ug&channel=CARS&make=VOLKSWAGEN&model=GOLF&min_pr=500&max_pr=1000&max_mileage=&vehicleYearOfManufacture=1994&vehicleRegLetter=M
:wink:
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http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=115764.0
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Retro track coolness :cool:
(http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/uploads/new/23252.jpg)
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http://search.autotrader.co.uk/es-uk/www/cars/VOLKSWAGEN+GOLF/Ne-2-4-5-6-7-8-27-44-49-53-61-64-67-103-133-146-236,N-12-29-240-4294966835-4294966886/advert.action?R=200918333593235&distance=71&postcode=ox106ug&channel=CARS&make=VOLKSWAGEN&model=GOLF&min_pr=500&max_pr=1000&max_mileage=&vehicleYearOfManufacture=1994&vehicleRegLetter=M
:wink:
Too many doors and not enough valves for a MKIII!
nick
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:grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
stripped out you wont miss the valves :tongue:
long mot - local to you
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VW-Mk3-GOLF-GTI-8v-PURPLE-Tax-MOT_W0QQitemZ270386816410QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAutomobiles_UK?hash=item270386816410&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A2|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A0|293%3A1|294%3A50
:grin:
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I say do what they did on top gear Camper van derby then you get the best of both worlds :laugh: :laugh:
But seriously i would go for the track car :D
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I just can't get ecited about MKIII's unless they have 6 pots, and I ain't gonna find of them i can afford to track!
nick
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What about the link i posted:
http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=115764.0
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See post above!
nick
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Rocco 1.8 you know it makes sense
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If only this:
http://www.edition38.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=227195
had MOT and tax, although if it did it would be up for twice as much!
nick
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shame its got to be road legal
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Volkswagen-Golf-Mk2-Gti-Big-bumper-lowered-spax-k-n_W0QQitemZ180344068722QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAutomobiles_UK?hash=item180344068722&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A2|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A0|293%3A3|294%3A50
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See post above!
nick
Fair so you're looking for a cheap GTI mk2 for what kinda moneys?
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£600 max but would prefer £500. Thing is as I'm going to track it so I don't care if it looks a bit tatty with a few dents and scrapes as I'll no doubt be adding to them. Just needs to be ok Engine and box wise with test until the end of the summer at the least with no nasty grot on the actually body.
One will come up and I'm not in a huge rush.
Nick
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nick - be different
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1990-VOLKSWAGEN-JETTA-GTI-ORANGE_W0QQitemZ300313103508QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAutomobiles_UK?hash=item300313103508&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A2|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50
reserve is posted in add - monies can be recouped by selling interior etc off as and when you strip it.
and at least people will see ya out there :laugh:
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Sirocco 1.6 GT £300?
Needs work though :sad:
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nick - be different
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1990-VOLKSWAGEN-JETTA-GTI-ORANGE_W0QQitemZ300313103508QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAutomobiles_UK?hash=item300313103508&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A2|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50
reserve is posted in add - monies can be recouped by selling interior etc off as and when you strip it.
and at least people will see ya out there :laugh:
Added to my watch list!
nick
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Got some rot, but thats easily sorted.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Volkswagen-Golf-GTI-Mk1-1800_W0QQitemZ320364216779QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAutomobiles_UK?hash=item320364216779&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A7%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50
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forget a 1.8
get someV6 power
:shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
http://www.clubgti.com/forum/showthread.php?t=190047
:grin:
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nick - be different
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1990-VOLKSWAGEN-JETTA-GTI-ORANGE_W0QQitemZ300313103508QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAutomobiles_UK?hash=item300313103508&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A2|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50
reserve is posted in add - monies can be recouped by selling interior etc off as and when you strip it.
and at least people will see ya out there :laugh:
Added to my watch list!
nick
If you are seriously looking at it and want me to check it out for you before bidding on it I will do, only 5 mins down the road from me.
Just drop me a pm.
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pm'd you a link nick - as its a bargain :lipsrsealed:
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Go on, YOU CAN DO IT
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Get on over to Germany and pick up something properly interesting and less rotten.
It'll only eat about £100 of your budget and I bet you'll have something more entertaining in the end.
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Cheap mk2 Syncro from Deutschland :)
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Well, maybe, but a Syncro track car's not for everyone.
Plenty of other Golf variants out there.
If you're contemplating a G3 track car, seek out Paul86S2 on here - he runs a stripped out G3 16V and campaigns it on track a lot.
It was his wife wot was driving when I passed it at Goodwood a few months ago, honest.
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I don't like threads like this :D I'm so tempted to track mine as it is not a daily anymore and I want to use it at some speed!, I have built it to drive it properly so I can't see why not :) would have to get trackdays insurance though I'd be gutted if I stacked it or binned it into someone else on a track :(
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would have to get trackdays insurance though I'd be gutted if I stacked it or binned it into someone else on a track :(
Forget it - the excess would likely be more than your car is worth. Track day insurance is for serious metal, not kiddy toys like Golfs.
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I meant more for if one of the serious metal ones ends up needing paying for, I can fix mine, I'd be gutted but could live with it :D
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You never end up paying for other people's cars on a track.
If there's an off and your car gets smashed it's big boy's rules - if you can't afford to play, don't play. If other people's cars get smashed - it's still big boy's rules - if you can't afford to play, don't play.
Track insurance covers repairs your car only, if it gets damage. No one else's (as far as I'm aware).
That's why you have to sign big-assed disclaimers before you go out and also why you see a surprising amount of what look to be cheap cars out there and why the Golf3 is likely to become more popular in the next few years.
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must not swap polo for mk3 trackcar :lipsrsealed:
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must not swap polo for mk3 trackcar :lipsrsealed:
Do it :P
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DO IT!!
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Campervan on track would be amasing but might require an engine upgrade from the smoker that's in it now. It barely does 70!
Nick
Rip the interior and stuff out and jam you'se a porker lump in the thing!
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Too late, it's already sold and track car has been purchased!
Nick
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...and broken I see!
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No I haven't broken it yet, I don't even pick it up till later in the week. Just changing it back to looking like an early GTi as it currently has big bumpers but the early side moldings. A real pet hate of mine.
nick
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You is so aufentik, innit.
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You is so aufentik, innit.
Well yeah, they look better in small bumper trim if they have the side moldings from the early cars. Also I can sell the big bumpers and spots and use the money to pay for important stuff like road steels + tyres and contirbute towards to a lid.
Sensible all round I think you'll agree. Also going to sell the rear lights and get half smoked or standard ones, whichever turn up first.
Nick
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No I haven't broken it yet, I don't even pick it up till later in the week. Just changing it back to looking like an early GTi as it currently has big bumpers but the early side moldings. A real pet hate of mine.
nick
My mistake, wrong person. So great minds do think alike then, I plan to small bumper mine this year.
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Good man and I like your new sig, that passat rocked but it's now been crushed :sad:
nick
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Good man and I like your new sig, that passat rocked but it's now been crushed :sad:
nick
WTF :shocked:
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Was rotten in the sills. My mate bought it of me and put the coilies and engine in his MKII GTI.
Nick
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gutted :cry:
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with hindsight that passat would have been a parts bin haven for your new mk2!
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Yes it would have been but it couldn't stay outside the flat with no tax so I had no choice.
Still, onwards and upwards. MKII is now insured so just waiting to hear back if he's taxed it and put some plats on it and then I can arrange collection. WoooHoo!
nick
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MKII is now insured so just waiting to hear back if he's taxed it and put some plats on it and then I can arrange collection. WoooHoo!
Plaits are this year's wood-effect, so I hear.....
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why not kill 2 birds with 1 stone and do this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XvjVvFdMIY :shocked: