GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: willni on 05 June 2022, 11:23
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Wondering if anyone has made the move from a 7.5 GTI performance pack to a mk7 Ed40 Clubsport?
Saw a nice one for sale in England, sunroof, leather, dynaudio in 3 door & pure white and most importantly manual.
The problem is it has 20k miles (5 times what my 7.5 gti had when I purchased it) and also costs more than what I paid for my 7.5 as I bought it before the price increases.
I like the clubsport but feel like it's possibly a bad move and I should wait for a TCR to come down.
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Try one willni..... I moved from mk7 PP to ed40 CS, the reason I moved was the spec of the car I bought.
Do you want an Ed40 with leather seats, a sunroof & manual? I know I didn't want the seats & sunroof! :)
Waiting for a TCR to come down in price is one option, but they are DSG only, so why consider a manual Ed40.... I must admit I am a little confused! :)
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After driving a TCR I feel that one of them is definitely going to be my next move. I've got a standard MK7 GTI currently and whilst I've done a few bits to it (VWR springs and CSS backbox), the TCR is an all round better car. The interior is much more polished and the overall performance of the car is much more confidence inspiring than mine is. I didn't expect it to be that much better and to be completely honest, when I stepped out of it on the test drive I wasn't actually that impressed - that was until I then went and drove the same road in my car.
Whilst the ED40 is nice, I think the 7.5s are better looking both inside and out so I'd so TCR. But that's just me!
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Try one willni..... I moved from mk7 PP to ed40 CS, the reason I moved was the spec of the car I bought.
Do you want an Ed40 with leather seats, a sunroof & manual? I know I didn't want the seats & sunroof! :)
Waiting for a TCR to come down in price is one option, but they are DSG only, so why consider a manual Ed40.... I must admit I am a little confused! :)
In my opinion the manual gearbox is the desired spec for the clubsport, the 6-speed DSG was too hesitant, the 7-speed DSG is great. Yes I'd say this one is fairly close to my desired spec only thing is I'd rather have the Oryx White.
I didn't expect it to be that much better and to be completely honest, when I stepped out of it on the test drive I wasn't actually that impressed - that was until I then went and drove the same road in my car.
Funny that's how I felt about my gti versus my old gtd, I'd also say the 7.5's better looking but the clubsport is it's own thing which looks great.
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Fair point in respect to the 6 speed Dsg.
Each to their own, personally I much prefer the mk7 CS front & rear styling to the mk 7.5 cars, it was good to see VW make so much effort in their design.
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My thoughts:
7.5 GTI better looking, with better headlights, better interior upgrades and they sound quite good. The engine has loads of torque from just over tickover but is lower revving.
Ed40 has unique looks, unique interior with cloth but the leather gets ambient lighting which the cloth lacks.
The chassis feels slightly more agile, the engine less torquey but revs out well. Manual gearbox suits the car. The fluffy steering wheel is nice. The car feels special.
The Ed40 being at least 4 years old needs to have had a sympathetic previous owner.
The Ed40 also has swirl and scratch magnet gloss black everywhere so just think of the satisfaction of getting that all polished up…
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Got my CS Edition 40 back in September in White, it has the 6 speed DSG and I’m am biased, but I think it looks great with a few modest tweaks. I put a stage 1 Revo map on it and this has totally transformed the driving experience. I hope to get the DSG map in the next Revo sale. It’s pretty much each to their own, but who doesn’t love looking at a TCR when you spot one, I love it in Red. A bold move either way with the petrol prices atm, both great looking cars. I use mine as my daily, no regrets so far. Drive both and you’ll make your own decision, good luck.
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Btw M8, there’s a few white Edition 40 in Up for sale close to you and a TCR in Belfast, get those test drives done ! If you are feeling flush there’s even an Edition 45 👌
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My thoughts:
7.5 GTI better looking, with better headlights, better interior upgrades and they sound quite good. The engine has loads of torque from just over tickover but is lower revving.
Ed40 has unique looks, unique interior with cloth but the leather gets ambient lighting which the cloth lacks.
The chassis feels slightly more agile, the engine less torquey but revs out well. Manual gearbox suits the car. The fluffy steering wheel is nice. The car feels special.
The Ed40 being at least 4 years old needs to have had a sympathetic previous owner.
The Ed40 also has swirl and scratch magnet gloss black everywhere so just think of the satisfaction of getting that all polished up…
Out of curiosity, if you were to be buying a used TCR now what kind of spec would you be looking for? Or would you take a Mk8 CS instead?
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My thoughts:
7.5 GTI better looking, with better headlights, better interior upgrades and they sound quite good. The engine has loads of torque from just over tickover but is lower revving.
Ed40 has unique looks, unique interior with cloth but the leather gets ambient lighting which the cloth lacks.
The chassis feels slightly more agile, the engine less torquey but revs out well. Manual gearbox suits the car. The fluffy steering wheel is nice. The car feels special.
The Ed40 being at least 4 years old needs to have had a sympathetic previous owner.
The Ed40 also has swirl and scratch magnet gloss black everywhere so just think of the satisfaction of getting that all polished up…
Out of curiosity, if you were to be buying a used TCR now what kind of spec would you be looking for? Or would you take a Mk8 CS instead?
It would be getting PPF'd straight away after correcting the gloss black :wink: It's actually had 2 owners assuming 1 business and 1 actual owner since it's on 23k miles with full VW history and the leather looks hardly sat in.
TCR wise - Sunroof, performance pack for Reifnitz and ACC, leather or cloth, dynaudio, 3 door in white, grey or red and importantly the Akrapovic.
A members brother on here purchased one a few weeks ago in black which had great spec actually but feel black doesn't do the TCR justice as it would lose the black details
But no, no real interest in the mk8's at all the interior is the off putting thing.
Btw M8, there’s a few white Edition 40 in Up for sale close to you and a TCR in Belfast, get those test drives done ! If you are feeling flush there’s even an Edition 45 👌
They're actually not great spec examples and the TCR has budget tyres on it which instantly puts me off for such a young car, considering my car has seen more goodyears and michelins on it just for fun :grin: The Ed45 is nice but also is more much expensive than the M2 Competitions I was looking at.
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My thoughts:
7.5 GTI better looking, with better headlights, better interior upgrades and they sound quite good. The engine has loads of torque from just over tickover but is lower revving.
Ed40 has unique looks, unique interior with cloth but the leather gets ambient lighting which the cloth lacks.
The chassis feels slightly more agile, the engine less torquey but revs out well. Manual gearbox suits the car. The fluffy steering wheel is nice. The car feels special.
The Ed40 being at least 4 years old needs to have had a sympathetic previous owner.
The Ed40 also has swirl and scratch magnet gloss black everywhere so just think of the satisfaction of getting that all polished up…
Out of curiosity, if you were to be buying a used TCR now what kind of spec would you be looking for? Or would you take a Mk8 CS instead?
It would be getting PPF'd straight away after correcting the gloss black :wink: It's actually had 2 owners assuming 1 business and 1 actual owner since it's on 23k miles with full VW history and the leather looks hardly sat in.
TCR wise - Sunroof, performance pack for Reifnitz and ACC, leather or cloth, dynaudio, 3 door in white, grey or red and importantly the Akrapovic.
A members brother on here purchased one a few weeks ago in black which had great spec actually but feel black doesn't do the TCR justice as it would lose the black details
It seems that getting a 3dr with a decent spec is almost impossible, I think I'd definitely want the Akkra although lots of people say to just not both with that?
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Got mine from Hurst, had horrible Chinese tyres on it, nearly killed me in the wet, so had to go out and get new ones put on within a week, went for Goodyears to try out. I would normally use the PS4s but fancied these. Getting the perfect spec is hard, those so many different ones about.
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Looking at the pictures of your red GTI, that must be a real difficult decision you must be weighing up.
As much as i obviously like a CS your red GTI is stunning. :smiley:
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TCR wise - Sunroof, performance pack for Reifnitz and ACC, leather or cloth, dynaudio, 3 door in white, grey or red and importantly the Akrapovic.
All the 3 door cars were pre the update with the Akrapovic exhaust. Mine is too and I think the standard exhaust is great, a nice deep sound without being ott. If a daily driver I'd say the TCR is the better bet. As a driver's car though, a 3 door manual CS with Recaros would be perfect.
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Out of curiosity, if you were to be buying a used TCR now what kind of spec would you be looking for? Or would you take a Mk8 CS instead?
Ohh, good question!
Without wanting to drag Will’s thread off topic too much I’d say my personal preferences wouldn’t mirror many other people’s.
99% would probably want DCC, and now I have hindsight I wouldn’t. So I’d take either car so long as it didn’t have it.
Therefore I’m probably the last person to ask.
Many TCR’s were ordered in as dealer stock so had various mixtures of options added, I’ve no idea if the dealers had any say in it.
I see a TCR as a pretty special looking and feeling car which was pretty loaded with spec from the factory as a run out edition. Obviously the Akra holds huge interest but mine didn’t have it and it’s not something I’d worry about having either as the standard exhaust was specially tuned to make its own distinctive sound.
Dynaudio is excellent so I’d prefer one with that. Not a deal breaker though.
A black roof looks good but a wrap is an easy addition.
All of the options of wheel look good so I’d not worry about which it came with.
Mine had a heated front screen, it was ok but even as an early morning commuter in winter I still don’t miss it.
So I’m pretty flexible really. Boring eh?
Would I choose a mk8 Clubsport instead?
Well that depends on the cost difference.
The TCR is way better looking and very close on driving dynamics, so a well specced TCR for just a little less than a boggo Clubsport mk8 would be quite compelling.
A well specced TCR versus a specced up Clubsport mk8 and a big price differential and I’d take the TCR any time. At that sort of money I’d rather have a specced R or better still an Ed45 than a Clubsport optioned up.
That’s just me personally.
I kind of like the Clubsport without options as it seems more err, Clubsporty
As a model I like it for its extra driving dynamics over a regular GTI yet keeping relative simplicity (not easy in a tech laden modern car) which takes me back to my younger days where an enthusiast owner would buy a GTI and do a few tweaks to make it go a little better, handle a little better and look a tiny bit better than it left the factory. The Clubsport has those tweaks already done from the factory.
And as far as driving dynamics go then the mk8 Clubsport gets the nod. Just.
So it depends on what a prospective owner wants. Gadgets, luxury or simplicity.
I like the latter mostly.
Bugger, I did go a bit off topic there.
We all like different things. And sometimes what we think we like we end up finding out we don’t. And something we are not expecting to like we find we actually do, sometimes quite a lot.
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Out of curiosity, if you were to be buying a used TCR now what kind of spec would you be looking for? Or would you take a Mk8 CS instead?
Ohh, good question!
Without wanting to drag Will’s thread off topic too much I’d say my personal preferences wouldn’t mirror many other people’s.
99% would probably want DCC, and now I have hindsight I wouldn’t. So I’d take either car so long as it didn’t have it.
Therefore I’m probably the last person to ask.
Many TCR’s were ordered in as dealer stock so had various mixtures of options added, I’ve no idea if the dealers had any say in it.
I see a TCR as a pretty special looking and feeling car which was pretty loaded with spec from the factory as a run out edition. Obviously the Akra holds huge interest but mine didn’t have it and it’s not something I’d worry about having either as the standard exhaust was specially tuned to make its own distinctive sound.
Dynaudio is excellent so I’d prefer one with that. Not a deal breaker though.
A black roof looks good but a wrap is an easy addition.
All of the options of wheel look good so I’d not worry about which it came with.
Mine had a heated front screen, it was ok but even as an early morning commuter in winter I still don’t miss it.
So I’m pretty flexible really. Boring eh?
Would I choose a mk8 Clubsport instead?
Well that depends on the cost difference.
The TCR is way better looking and very close on driving dynamics, so a well specced TCR for just a little less than a boggo Clubsport mk8 would be quite compelling.
A well specced TCR versus a specced up Clubsport mk8 and a big price differential and I’d take the TCR any time. At that sort of money I’d rather have a specced R or better still an Ed45 than a Clubsport optioned up.
That’s just me personally.
I kind of like the Clubsport without options as it seems more err, Clubsporty
As a model I like it for its extra driving dynamics over a regular GTI yet keeping relative simplicity (not easy in a tech laden modern car) which takes me back to my younger days where an enthusiast owner would buy a GTI and do a few tweaks to make it go a little better, handle a little better and look a tiny bit better than it left the factory. The Clubsport has those tweaks already done from the factory.
And as far as driving dynamics go then the mk8 Clubsport gets the nod. Just.
So it depends on what a prospective owner wants. Gadgets, luxury or simplicity.
I like the latter mostly.
Bugger, I did go a bit off topic there.
We all like different things. And sometimes what we think we like we end up finding out we don’t. And something we are not expecting to like we find we actually do, sometimes quite a lot.
Some really excellent points there, I think for myself I'd like the DCC as it's an option I've never had before but I'd be interested to hear why you wouldn't take it?
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Ended up passing on the Clubsport, too many cons for it versus a TCR. So I'll be on the look out for the right TCR over the next 2 years, dynaudio and akra exhaust being the non-moveable options, sunroof and performance pack being desirable.
I also saw someone that put a clubsport wing on their TCR as it really sold it for me...
(https://i.postimg.cc/7Z3FHrzt/IMG-3405.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/NK0JDVpR)
(https://i.postimg.cc/52WcW2XF/IMG-3406.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Mv53yxbW)
(https://i.postimg.cc/kXbrHbgm/IMG-3407.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/MvqrMXBP)
(https://i.postimg.cc/XNhSx83L/IMG-3408.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4nzSxpYH)
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Ended up passing on the Clubsport, too many cons for it versus a TCR. So I'll be on the look out for the right TCR over the next 2 years, dynaudio and akra exhaust being the non-moveable options, sunroof and performance pack being desirable.
I also saw someone that put a clubsport wing on their TCR as it really sold it for me...
(https://i.postimg.cc/7Z3FHrzt/IMG-3405.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/NK0JDVpR)
(https://i.postimg.cc/52WcW2XF/IMG-3406.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Mv53yxbW)
(https://i.postimg.cc/kXbrHbgm/IMG-3407.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/MvqrMXBP)
(https://i.postimg.cc/XNhSx83L/IMG-3408.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4nzSxpYH)
That does look great, although I think the CS wing is a very expensive option to get it from VW?
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Tricky one. Personally I prefer the 7.5 GTIPP manual for the difference in price.
I’ve driven a TCR and there wasn’t enough of a difference unless you crave power and don’t want a remap for warranty purposes etc. I don’t track my car so the PP/manual is fine for me for the road and I prefer the tartan to the TCR interior - horses for courses on that though.
Not driven a 7CS with the buckets and 2 seats but seems to me much more special and likely sought after in time.
Maybe other differences I don’t know about though.
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I also saw someone that put a clubsport wing on their TCR as it really sold it for me...
I always thought the CS had a different tailgate to a GTI, so fitting a CS spoiler on another model may not be as so straightforward as it sounds??
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I also saw someone that put a clubsport wing on their TCR as it really sold it for me...
I always thought the CS had a different tailgate to a GTI, so fitting a CS spoiler on another model may not be as so straightforward as it sounds??
correct, it's an entire boot lid replacement.
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I also saw someone that put a clubsport wing on their TCR as it really sold it for me...
I always thought the CS had a different tailgate to a GTI, so fitting a CS spoiler on another model may not be as so straightforward as it sounds??
correct, it's an entire boot lid replacement.
Think it's a tailgate off a base model Golf IIRC??
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Apparently so, I would love to hear someone from VW explain why they did that, choosing not to design the CS spoiler around the GTi tailgate? :)
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Apparently so, I would love to hear someone from VW explain why they did that, choosing not to design the CS spoiler around the GTi tailgate? :)
Did the CS spoiler not need a flatter section to mount the middle piece of the spoiler hence the standard golf lid? Could purely be aerodynamic flow though, that the gti one interrupts the flow of the CS spoiler.
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I also saw someone that put a clubsport wing on their TCR as it really sold it for me...
I always thought the CS had a different tailgate to a GTI, so fitting a CS spoiler on another model may not be as so straightforward as it sounds??
correct, it's an entire boot lid replacement.
Think it's a tailgate off a base model Golf IIRC??
Standard golf tailgate, CS glass because it's tinted then the spoiler from memory it runs people about £2.5k to do, only seen it done twice.
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I'd like the DCC as it's an option I've never had before but I'd be interested to hear why you wouldn't take it?
Too squishy in comfort and too ready to transfer weight onto the outside front wheel when turning gently (albeit briefly) which didn’t match the stiff(ish) springs. It improved when driving quite hard but I don’t get to drive like that very often.
Setting it to its firmest setting was a bit too firm, it felt like running 50psi in the front tyres at times.
What sealed its fate for me was when I had a back injury and it would cause me agony at times when hitting a dual carriageway or motorway expansion joint where the dampers didn’t react quick enough to the jolt.
Everyone else seems to think it’s the best thing since sliced bread so I’d advise a good test drive before making up your mind. You might love it!
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I'd like the DCC as it's an option I've never had before but I'd be interested to hear why you wouldn't take it?
Too squishy in comfort and too ready to transfer weight onto the outside front wheel when turning gently (albeit briefly) which didn’t match the stiff(ish) springs. It improved when driving quite hard but I don’t get to drive like that very often.
Setting it to its firmest setting was a bit too firm, it felt like running 50psi in the front tyres at times.
What sealed its fate for me was when I had a back injury and it would cause me agony at times when hitting a dual carriageway or motorway expansion joint where the dampers didn’t react quick enough to the jolt.
Everyone else seems to think it’s the best thing since sliced bread so I’d advise a good test drive before making up your mind. You might love it!
That all seems to make sense to me tbh. I'm a bit of a tinkerer myself so I'd likely be changing to some lowering springs anyway so I'm kind of numb to the harshness that you describe. Although I think the comfort settings is interesting, I can imagine what you mean though. My parents have a Skoda Superb and it's almost like it floats which is what I am imagining it to feel like.
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Just to add perspective, with the stiffer springs fitted to mk7 CS & 7.5 TCR, DCC works well with 19" wheels on a Golf!
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DCC doesn't actually appeal to be to be honest, I've never found 19s that hard I found 18s on bridgestones the hardest. I'd only want the performance pack for the Reifnitz, but even then it's not a deal breaker as I'd just buy some BBS' again or as most of you would know with my gti change alloys 5 times in a year...
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DCC doesn't actually appeal to be to be honest, I've never found 19s that hard I found 18s on bridgestones the hardest. I'd only want the performance pack for the Reifnitz, but even then it's not a deal breaker as I'd just buy some BBS' again or as most of you would know with my gti change alloys 5 times in a year...
Will, have you tried 19"s on a CS or TCR, they have upgraded, as in slightly stiffer springs than a regular GTi.
Dcc certainly seems desirable for many buyers, VW even fitted it to the CS-S as standard equipment, what were they thinking? :)
DCC is not the be all & end all of suspension, it's nice to have some adjutability, personally I would say a high end coilover suspension would be better, but that was not offered by VW and is a fairly niche aftermarket modifocation among the whole of GTI owners.
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The CS-S had adjustable dampers because it’s a track focussed car therefore they could program it accordingly for a specific track to do a specific job using appropriate springs for the situation. Same as with the aero and choice of rear hatch.
A very limited run to do a very specific job on a given budget.
Springs dictate ride. Hard springs don’t compress very quickly so need firm dampers to prevent a crash being transmitted to the cabin. Go too firm on both and you get the crash. Go too soft on the dampers and you get the crash. The happy medium is in the middle.
Reactive dampers in a ‘comfort’ setting take a slight amount of time to adjust their valving so by the time your small sidewall tyres and stiff springs have made contact with a sharp bump or depression the jolt will be transmitted to the cabin before the dampers can stiffen sufficiently. Not great when you have a bad back. Not nice for passengers. Liveable in a track special like a CS-S maybe, but it’s not for me.
20 odd years of aftermarket suspensions on a variety of cars and I’ve grown very weary of poor ride quality. My mk8 Clubby on standard non-DCC and pig iron 19’s is pretty bumpy at times but it’s not crashy. I hate crashy.
Driven hard and smoothly, anticipating every move and loading the suspension up before a corner is how a CS-S does the bends of the green hell so rapidly, bouncing off the kerbs every few seconds with the driver not having to listen to their passenger moaning every time it jolts up through their spine.
Still, what do I know eh?
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I understand that curiously, the CSS ran it's ring lap in comfort mode so that it could ride those kerbs. I don't know if you have driven a CSS on the road, it is not uncomfortable at all in comfort setting on a UK B road. I would be more concerned over the damage to the pretoria alloys on kerbs & potholes?
My nordschliefe laps have only been in 911', when its your own car and alloys are that expensive, you tend not to ride the kerbs too agressively! :)
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My last post got cut a bit short as I wrote it hastily while on call hold to the dentist.
I meant to add in that your point about aftermarket properly matched adjustable suspension would be the perfect solution to the issue but as far as standard factory suspension goes the DCC seems a bit too compromised to me, hence the “what do I know?” as I’m not the highly paid engineer developing these (DCC) systems or the journalists who assure us it’s an essential option.
It all depends on how a given owner uses the vehicle really and what their tolerances are. I know what I prefer but I’m likely in a small minority.
Caveat emptor is all I can say!
Unfortunately I didn’t ever get to try a CS-S, a big regret that I wasn’t brave enough to buy one new when I had the chance. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.
I’d have never been brave enough to track it but it would have suited my general uses quite well right now. :cry:
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Interesting that the new Lotus Emira comes with standard suspension and then you then have to choose the setup, either Touring or Sport so they like to keep it simple.
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Is there anything to be said for a set of £200 JOM coilovers? :whistle:
There's no replacement for a proper coilover set up such a Ohlins or KW for those totally performance orientated. I know of a guy that had a Golf R with ACC and said he hated it and just put a delete kit on it and went to ordinary spring and damper suspension.
Think we're forgetting that the golf is the comfiest of it's competitors and many others are more firm some like the Megane RS just using ohlin coilovers which are a serviceable item! (At least the aftermarket ones are) so we shouldn't really complain.