GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk3 => Golf mk3 how to guides + info => Topic started by: Scooterist007 on 18 September 2003, 17:23
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Hi, wondered if anyone can help me cos i'm banging my head against a brickwall! >:(
I have a 1997 P reg gti 2.0l 8v and the problem i'm having is that the car keeps cutting out on me, it doesnt matter if i'm travelling at speed or not (infact its just happened while I was on the dartford crossing bridge at 5pm! very scarey) When it cuts out the oil light flashes and the rev counter goes straight to zero, now somtimes it will start straight away and somtimes it takes ages to start, when it doesnt start, the engine turns over as normal but the oil light flashes.
Now the first thing I checked was the Oil (duh!) But the oil is ok, when i take the oil filler cap of, there is presure there so I think the oil pump is ok, and I dont think its an oil problem cos if there was a problem surley it would do it all the time, somtimes its weeks before it would cut out and somtimes it does it several times a day! I once went to a party when I met a guy who is a salesman for vw, and he reckons its the hall effect sensor, now I dont know wether this is true, after all he just sells the dam things!
Please can anyone help me?
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This has happened to my golf twice now in the last week.
In my case, the oil light came on and the car cuts out. This happened twice whilst I was accelerating in second gear. Not when slowling down.
Any help would be appeciated as this could be quite dangerous.
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scooterist007, this sounds exactly like the problem I had on my 97 P 8v. It got progressively worse until eventually it wouldnt start at all. Took it to the dealer and they diagnosed it as the Hall Sender Relay (not sure which one if there is more than one). The part cost ?13 but the total bill was about ?80-100. I will search out the invoice if you like and what they did.
There have been similar posts on this forum about problems like this, but as I say the symptoms you describe are exactly like what happened to me. Let me know if you want me to dig out the bill....you may then be able to try it yourself and save about ?80.
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Sorry for the delay in replying scooterist007, but here goes.
VW invoice said: "checked for non-starting. No spark. Checked coil. No readings recorded at hall sender. Checked and replaced ecu power supply relay".
Part number is 165906381 (?13 + vat). Haynes manual or the like should tell you where that relay goes.
Hope you get it sorted
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Well thanks for the help, I will get a relay tomorrow and hopefully my problem should be sorted. I will post a reply in a few days to let you all know if this works.
Cheers Guys
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Thanks for the reply. I wonder how this guy got on with his new relay. I'm buying one today and will fit tonight. I'll post if the problem goes or stays.
I've looked for ages on the web site and found a another with the same symptons so hopefully this relay will fix it.
Thanks again and I hope I don't have any more problems or the car will be being changed!!!
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Well what a journey to pick up the relay! Engine cut out 3 times. It did start each time after a few mins, but eventually I left it at the road side and walked to the VW Dealer.
Came back fitted the relay and drove back to work trouble free. next few days will tell if its fixed!
Ironic thing is, when I was pushing the car from the main road so as not to block the traffic, a nice man on a bike stopped and help me push. He said he had exactly the same thing on his golf but it was the "Hall sensor"
I really hope this doesn't happen again, I quite like my red Golf.
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Fitted Relay,
Driven home, gone out later and come home,
Got up this morning and gave my wife the car to test.
She drove to work this morning after dropping the kids off at school.
Car hasn't stopped! How long will this last?
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Sorry didn't see your message till now.
I got the part mentioned here! mine is an 8V and the part has a big "30" printed on the top of the relay.
I know its only been in for half a day but the cars done about 60 miles trouble free.
Yesterday it was cutting out every 5 mins on short journeys!
Part number is 165906381 (?14.99 inc vat)
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Where does the relay go?
I can then compare the old with new.
Maybe the bloke at the dealer got it wrong.
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In your fuse box
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Update,
Car now works ok!!!
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Update,
Car now works ok!!!
Glad you got it sorted and it was just the relay like mine. I dont know about you but once it was sorted it restored my confidence in the motor!! ;D Thats the good thing about this forum, always someone who knows the problem. Unfortunately I had to pay the dealer to sort, but glad the part number I posted was right. Happy motoring
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I too have a 97 P GTi 8 valver and was having a very similar problem. Whenever I approached a junction or roundabout and was slowing down, the revs would drop below usual tickover level (900) and then it would cut out altogether. only difference being from your problem the oil light didn't come on and it never did this when accellerating.
after looking at numerous forums, had seen allsorts of diagnosis and cures (pour carb cleaner in fuel line, air filter problems, hall sensor, ht leads etc) and asked a mechanic mate of mine who said none of these sounded like a cure.
Turns out the cam belt was 1 notch out so there was less power going to the engine hence revs dropping dangerously low. Cost was beggar all cos it was my mate and power now is increased and runs like a dream, had this fixed over a week ago and it hasn't cut out since! As I said it doesn't sound exactly the same but might be worth a look...
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Thanks for that, but it was definately the Relay. Its fine now. The engine dying under breaking and acceleration and the oil light flashing are the sure signs.
I'd suggest everyone with a golf buys a new relay for ?15 pounds and save the agro! (only if they are having similar issues!!)
Thanks to all that helped!
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Well Hi all, Sorry I have taken my time to reply to this thread that I started! Now for the update! I have replaced the said relay which was the right one for my car and so far it hasnt cut out once! horah ;D I'm always the pesimist as I say 'so far' but I do think it has solved the problem beacause just before I replaced it the car was cutting out four to five times in a 30 mile journey and was really doing my head in and my wife too and I couldnt stand her winging any more! So it seems to have two knock on effects: 1: I can now drive my car safely and 2: my wife thinks that I'm a VW god cos I repared MY car without getting my hands dirty!! 8) On a different note the gti is our first car and our second car is a vauxhall astra 1.4 :-[ and the reason for the vauxhall is that over 3 years ago I had a 16v Mk2 golf and put it in a tree one morning thanks to a pheasnt (bird thing!) well now last week a double decker bus decided to rearange the front of the vauxhall while going to work and it was his fault and payed out lots of money (lots more than what the cars worth) and a nice compensation claim and now I've decided to buy myself a nice corrado G60!! ;D All thanks to public transport
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At last..I thought I was the only one with this problem. Complete cut out...random, at all speeds wait 2 mins, and off she goes fine. Car booked in (again!) to try and sort this. Relay sounds very promising, and will suggest to VW that they look at this first. Will post results. What a great forum...cheers.
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i,d be pretty sure its ure hall sender unit. my gti done that as well and got really bad very quickly.
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My Gti 8v is still cutting out, under accelleration mostly, but now occasionally when stationary.
I have not got around to replacing relay no. 30, but do intend to soon.
My question is: my VW immoboliser still occasionally does that thing where the car starts but then cuts out a second later - whereby you then have to re-start it. I wondered if it could be the immobiliser playing silly buggers when driving and thus causing the cutting out.
I have never had the 'flashing oil light' and never had the 'dropping revs at junctions' symptoms either. When mine cuts out it is very quick (like the ignition has been cut off, i.e. immobilised) and does not seem to be a fuel startvation type of cutting out (i.e. fuel pump relay).
At speed the engine bump-starts itself again within a second, with the clutch dipped at junctions it just dies.
Help me please as I am rapidly losing confidence in my veedub, my 31 year-old beetle is becoming more reliable these days!
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Get the immobiliser checked out or get it cut!
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Replaced relay No. 30 in the end, and thought all was fine until this morning - cut out for split second on way into work. Nutsacs!!!
Looks like I will have to start messing around with the VW immobiliser - anyone know where there are any handy wires I could cut to immobilise the immobiliser???
If that doesn't work I may have to replace the Hall Sender (and thus the whole god damn dizzy!), a nice ?200 bill for that I beleive.
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You should be able to just replace the hall sender.
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Really? I was told that it was not removable on the mk3 Gti and that I have to buy a whole new dizzy - or were they telling me porky pies?
I have not seen any hall sender units sold seperately for the mk3 either, not on GSF or ECP anyway. Do you know of where I could get one, would it be easy to fit?
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Please help.
The cutting out loss of power problem is all over forums and very few have fixed it.
This relay sounds very promising as my golf has exactly the same problems described by so many.
I wanted to know if this only applied to those of you with GTI's
I have heard of other standard mk3's with the same problem but don't know if this Hall sensor Relay will fix mine?????
please help as i'm running short of time!
Thanks Mk3 1.8 CL
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Really? I was told that it was not removable on the mk3 Gti and that I have to buy a whole new dizzy - or were they telling me porky pies?
I have not seen any hall sender units sold seperately for the mk3 either, not on GSF or ECP anyway. Do you know of where I could get one, would it be easy to fit?
Scott, have a look at the earlier responses to this post, probably page 1 or 2, where I posted the VW part number for the Hall sender. I had this problem on my 8v and got the part (well VW diagnosed and fitted part) from VW for only ?13. Worth a try for the money.
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8vgti - that is the part No. for Relay No. 30; I know because I went & got one from VW last week, and as mentioned - did not cure the cutting out. Thanks for trying to help anyway. By the way, I only paid ?9.69 + VAT for mine! (Vindis VW, Milton Rd, Cambridge).
If anyone has had JUST the hall sender replaced and NOT the whole distriutor could they possibly post a part No. on here? I am running out of (cheap) ideas, I really don't want to have to replace the whole dizzy, the moths in my wallet need some peace!
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Sorry Scott my mistake, when I read my earlier post (page 2) I actually misinterpreted it!! On VW service sheet it said..."no readings recorded at hall sender...so replaced ECU power supply"...not as you say replaced hall sender. Surprising that the price of relay 30 can vary between dealers especially on such a low priced item. Let us know how you get on as would be interested to know.
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Scott I'm in the Cambridge area and after reading through this post I went to VW Vindis, St.Ives got the ECU relay for a tenner plugged it in this morning and no change :(
I'm having the engine stalling after about fifteen minutes from cold I replaced the fuel pump relay three weeks ago that stopped it for two weeks but then it started up last week, I've tried cleaning the throttle butterfly out, changing the ECU relay this morning I don't know what else to do, I think I'm going to replace the fuel pump relay agian see if it stops it again.
The thing is I even rang round a couple of VW dealers in the Cambridge/Peterbourgh area and they all said the same thing that it was the fuel pump relay.
If anyones got any other ideas I'd appreciate them.
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Have you changed anything else? or just the relays?
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Just the two relays and the ignition bit where your key goes in (don't know the right name for it) thats what the garage said it might be when I took it in. They were wrong however so I haven't taken it back.
Is this a common problem only on MK3 GTi 8v's or does other MK3's have this problem??
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I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Our 8v 2.0 Cabriolet has picked up this annoying trait of dying after about 5 miles and a local VW specialist was bewildered by it, the main dealer, Spirit in Banbury, has had 4 attempts at it and got nowhere near it.
I joined this site specifically to try and sort it - I thought it was just us!
Good news - we're not alone
Bad news - NO-ONE knows the bloody answer....
Well at least there are some good tips here - somewhere to start I guess. I'll try and keep you posted with my success - or lack of it.........
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Airflow meter or coil pack maybe, or cam sender, or engine speed sensor. Any of these SHOULD show up on a fault reader.
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No the garage I took it to used a VAG (is that what there called) didn't come up with anything. If this is such a common problem how can no VW garage have an answer??
The thing is like I said I replaced the fuel pump relay and it was good for two weeks but then it started backup again?
It frustating just before crimbo as well sod's law >:(
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I had mine fault-code read and all it threw up was an ABS fault (light was coming on occasionally - code clear sorted it), no other codes at all came up. Apparently if it was a dodgy hall sender, the code may not even come up unless the diagnostics machine was plugged in when it actually cut out! and I'm not paying ?29 an hour for a mechanic to ride around with me until it does cut out!
My coil pack did fry itself 6 months ago, but was replaced, so should be OK.
jaseb - don't s'pose you have the fuel pump relay part No.??? Your cutting out sounds exactly the same as mine in terms of timing. Usually after 15 mins (same spot on A14 usually) and around 76-82 degC oil temp - although this may not be inportant. Does yours just cut out for a fraction of a second and bump-start itself again?
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I haven't got the car at the mo i'll have a look for the part number and post tonight but the relay is number 167 its on the right hand side when you look up top row, I haven't noted what oil temp is but yeah it cuts for about half a secound most of the time then sometimes it just cuts totally out then the oil light flashes.
I'm not driving it at the mo its getting too dodgy cut out on me halfway across a roundabout the other day, I going to give the throttle housing and everything a proper clean out this weekend.
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Just for info, I put this query on www.VWmonline.co.uk and got a response suggesting I replace relay 109 in position 3 of the relay board. Without a manual that means nothing to me - is that a fix familiar to anyone else, or is it the same as replacing the "hall sender unit"?
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The part number for the Fuel Pump Relay is 191 906 383 it will cost you around ?16, post if this works
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I also have this problem and it is becoming progressively worse.
It has now got to the point where not only do I have to get up at 6 in the morning in the freezing f***ing cold but when i do my 8v will not start at all.
I had the AA out the other day to have a look for me and all he could suggest was cleaning the plugs and ht leads. Which to his credit worked temporarily.
I am going to try replacing the fuel pump and ecu relays as mentioned and will post any advancements. However, my symptoms seem to be slightly different in that it only happens now when it is wet.
I was wondering whether this may be due to a dodgy seal or the like, any suggestions would be appreciated.
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hi mate i have had this problem for a couple of months now and has got that bad i cant drive it any more !!! i have tried allmost everything but i think it could be the air flow meter ! i have been looking for a second hand one but no luck. a new one is about 350 quid i will let you know if this works.
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Maybe damp getting into the ht's. Try a new set of leads and plugs.
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I had exaectly the same problem, crusing down the motorway then engine cuts, oil light comes on and if you listen closely you can hear the relay chattering. Its not a normal ignition cut out because you need to turn the ignition off an on again to restart.
The local garage recommended that I change loads of things but the key indicator was that there was no code coming up on the diagnostic test. They simulated the fault by pulling the ECU relay (No 3).
Total cost of relay was around ?14 but the garage charged me ?150 including ?35 for using the diagnostic computer.
My tip, if you have a mark 3, especially P Reg, eplace the ECU relay as soon as possible or carry a spare .
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I am having real trouble finding the right relay to solve my cutting out problem.
I am off out this weekend to buy a new set of HT leads, spark plugs and possibly a distributor cap.
All that remains is this relay which keeps being mentioned.
Could someone please paste a link to either euro car parts or gsf sites which relates to the relay I need.
This is for a Golf Mk3 2.0l 8v.
Cheers
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I had exactly the same prob with my mk3. It cut out regardless of speed/temp etc. A new distributor fixed it totally :)
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Golf GTI Colour Concept (P)
I have the same problem cutting out when driving along take foot off the gas and blinking thing goes below the 9000 revs and cuts out 0mph - 90mph +
DANGEROUS
Also when i stop the car turn off ignition then try and start again itturns over but does not fire up and start this happens 2 out of 10 times of trying to start the car
I am getting hold of a ecu relay in 2 days which goes in slot 3 if anybody can help further please reply :'(
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Sounds exactly like my mk3, it would cut out and then not want to start again, no matter how fast i was going or how hot the engine was.
The problem didnt show up on a vw diagnostic check thing, and they had it in for weeks trying to puzzle it out. The main mechanic suggested a new distributor (which cost me ?235 fitted all in) and it cured it. Never had another problem after that :)
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i had a new distributer put on 2months ago because the car wouldnt go over 5000revsnow it goes over 5000revs but also goes to 0revs aswell lol
bloody thing
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ah....so it is prob not that then.......good luck with it mate, its a bugger when stuff like that goes wrong.
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well i have just fitted the relay number (30) but it does not stop the car cutting out it must be something else
any ideas :'(
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:'( Hi, Guess what, I've got the same problem on my P reg Golf GTi. Cuts out, anytime, anyplace, anywhere, but now I think it's finally given up the ghost altogether. It has been getting progressively worse since I bought it in May,2003. I was hoping it was just a one off fault that would cure itself but it has just got worse, garage replaced the coil, but still the problem remained. Went to the doctors today and it just would not start at all to get me home and I had to be towed home by the AA man who is certain that it is the distributor, so I'm off to buy one tomorrow, I'll let you know if it cures the problem.
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:D :D
I am so glad I found this site.As previously mentioned my P reg Golf GTi packed up completely yesterday and I had to have a tow home from the AA. I had already had the car examined by a VW independent specialist? who fitted a new coil for ?130 .The AA man said it was likely to be the distributor so I located one at Volksbits for 45 smackers but I thought before I go and get that secondhand item I would try a new relay as recommended in this forum , relay 165 906 381 and lo and behold my car burst into life as soon as I fitted it in, I'm well chuffed and , touch wood, this should have cured the problem, time will tell but I'll let you know if the problem reoccurs, Cheers.
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i`m glad to here that u have fixed your problem in my case i have havd a new distributer and the new said relay but my problem is still there i am going to take it to a rolling road today and see what happends then
let u knows
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well i have just had my car put through its passes on the garages computer and what do u know it passed all the test so the guy came out with me in the car with the computer plugged in and the car stalled at a junction.
Nothing showed up on his computer so took it back to the garage and they told me it is not electrical or sensor fault.
what sugestion they did come up with is to buy 10k carbon cleaner which u spray up into the air flow to clean all carbon.
So i have just done that will post in next couple of days to let you all know what its like
chin up folks :)
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10k carbon cleaner works
any body with this fault should try it it cost ?20 and does the job.
It is the first time my car has not stalled really happy now ;D
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I had the same problem cutting out randomly with oil light flashing, got it scanned and was told it was the speed sensor (intermintent problem)?, luckilly enough i checked this forum and replaced relay (no 30), and the car wsa finbe for around 60miles. Had one slight stall with oil light flashing this morning. so wanted to know if any one knows what a speed sesnor does, or is it jsut worth keeping a spare relay in the car?
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it is worth trying (Y K 10 BOOST) it comes in a spray you add it in your air intake cleans the carbon out of the housing where you have some sensors and idle speed i have posted this before but name was wrong for ?20 it also gives better hp so you should notice better perfomance aswell as constent power
TRY IT
available at most car stores
if you try post reply to see if it has improved your car (s)
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"If only everything in life was as reliable as a Volkswagen"..so the 90's ad stated !
See my thread: http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?board=5;action=display;threadid=5481
My 8v Mk3 had a new distributor, plugs, leads etc at VW for ?300 before I owned it and didn't cure the intermittent cut out. Just got it back with a new ignition switch fitted (under warranty from non-VW dealer) and has not cut out yet (400 miles of mixed conditions)
Great forum and plenty of things to go at for those who are suffering/have suffered the frustrations of this fault!
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it is worth trying (Y K 10 BOOST) it comes in a spray you add it in your air intake cleans the carbon out of the housing where you have some sensors and idle speed i have posted this before but name was wrong for ?20 it also gives better hp so you should notice better perfomance aswell as constent power
TRY IT
available at most car stores
if you try post reply to see if it has improved your car (s)
So this stuff does actually work then? The original relay (30) replacement cured my problem but now stalling occassionally as the revs die. Various possible answers to this, but thought it would be worth a try using the carb cleaner. Have also seen the post re: Eco tek power boost foam, which does actually have more positive reviews. Any thoughts on this?? ???
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if you can get hold of eco tec it does the same thing
it is suppose to be better but hard to get hold of straight away eco is foam based where is yk 10 is a liquid
echo is also supposed to be lamber friendly but as i say yk 10 boost
WORKS
at are local performance centre a representative from eco put a mini camera inside the throttle bay and it was all clogged up after they used eco foam they put the camera back inside and the result was it looked brand new GLEAMING inside with an extra 10 hp
no harm to try
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if you can get hold of eco tec it does the same thing
it is suppose to be better but hard to get hold of straight away eco is foam based where is yk 10 is a liquid
echo is also supposed to be lamber friendly but as i say yk 10 boost
WORKS
at are local performance centre a representative from eco put a mini camera inside the throttle bay and it was all clogged up after they used eco foam they put the camera back inside and the result was it looked brand new GLEAMING inside with an extra 10 hp
no harm to try
Cheers for that svine...I will give it a try, especially as the motor has 115k. Just for info you can order the eco tek power boost direct from the website for ?27.50 all in. www.ecotekplc.co.uk
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thanks for that webb site i have ordered eco tek now so i will try that on my wife`s car wich is a tigra 16v
and see how that performs i wont use it in my gti because yk 10 did the trick (and the old saying is dont fix something that is not broken)
well thats what i say anyway
cheers
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I have a1997 P reg Golf 1.6 GL
The problem first started when the battery went flat. I took it out and charged it. The car wouldn?t start at first and then it did. Then the cutting-out started. It seems random. Sometimes when driving, sometimes just idling.
I took it to my usual garage for a full service (?125) and they said they couldn?t find a problem. I booked it into a VW garage. When I went to take it in, the battery was flat so I bought a new one (?45). They ran a test with their computer and said it showed no errors in the log. One of the mechanics took it home with the computer attached. The next day they left it running all day and it didn?t cut out at all. They said they had checked all the electrics and something that can get blocked by carbon deposits. So I picked it up (65+VAT).
Sure enough it cut out again. So I came here. I just went to buy a new ECU relay. It cut out on the way. Part number 16590638 (?8.50+VAT). I put the new relay in (3rd from left on the top row of relays in the fuse box under the steering wheel). It hasn?t cut-out yet.
I?ll be back if it does.
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I have been out and bought some of the above carb cleaner from a local auto parts place, but im now in two minds about how much to apply into the throttle body.
1. Loads seen as I am convinced mine is clogged up as it has never had any attention and gets driven around london daily
OR
2. Not so much as the spray turns to liquid and I am not sure whether this will harm the engine wherever it will run in to.
Any advice appreciated as I am thinking this is the main cause of my problems
Thanks
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the yk 10 boost will not harm your engine you need to follow the instructions on the can it is very simple and you must use all the contents of the can you will find you will notice a difference in the running of your car
ok
the cure?
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Ive been having pretty much the same probs but only when the engine is cold or has just warmed up 2 temperature. After a few revs, it starts working!
My ECU is showing 2 faults which relate to the standard VW immobiliser so im off to get that fixed by VW on the 4th March!
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well I finally found my problem... my cutting out was due to a faulty engine speed sensor (crank). I had it installed today.... fixed the problem.
It's basically a f**king magnet and 2 wires that cost 120 quid... My mountain bike speed sensor works in exactly the same way, but was 12 quid!
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Gday guys and gals,
Ive also had this problem on my mk3 gti 8v(95 m reg). Problem only happens when slowing down revs drop and it suts out.
Took car to vw today and they found a faulty temp sensor. Replaced that and paid ?86 part was ?19 oh how i love vw labour charges.
Will keep you posted as to whether the problem continues.
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SURPRISE SURPRISE problem still there. Another ?90 well spent on highly qualified VW technicians(?53.50per hour @ VW St Ives)
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Hello again to the cut-out regulars - just an update on my cutting out saga....
I had the 'cutting out for a split second' type of problem.
Replaced relay No.30 - No change
Had fault codes read - None shown for cutting-out related things
Had new distributor fitted (to change Hall sender) - No change
Car now does 3 types of cutting out! Yey!
1.) Cuts out for split second after warming up, usually twice per trip
2.) Cut out and stayed out for 10 secs with oil light flashing on motorway yesterday (which it has never done before).
3.) Stalled in Tesco car park and refused to restart with several re-trys, RAC called and it started 1st time for him of course! Was after about 15mins left alone though.
I am really tearing my hair out with this car now, I have lost all confidence in it and feel that this is a common Mk3 Gti problem that VW are probably aware of - if not then they damn well should be made aware of it! Too many cars have this problem for it to be 'normal' and coincidental!!!
My next plan is to change the crank sensor and the HT leads. If they dont work then I will be buying a Honda! Sod VW if this is the 'reliability' they sell their cars on!
Any further suggestions welcome. (May also try the 10k carbon cleaner too).
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Hi can anybody please answer the BIG QUESTION
What is the fix for the GOLF MK3 GTI cutting out issue?
Is it a simple change of relay 30 VW part 165906381 ?
Please can somebody answer as its becoming very anoying! Thanks
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Sorted out the cutting out issue - I changed the relay 30 but it was still cutting out so i cleaned out the throttle body with carb cleaner and its all running fine now. No cutting out!
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Scott get your Throttle body cleaned out!
Its the reason why your car is cutting out
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Skevas,
Funnily enough, I did clean my throttle body out on Sunday (with petrol) and the car has cut out since then, very dissapointing!
I also now have a fast idle at startup! Doh!
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Went through the usual c**p local vw dealer came back with no suggestions.
Changed plugs, ht leads distributor cap, rotary arm no change.
I Changed relay No: 30 and it made the thing worse.
Cleaned out the air flow and throttle body.
Oh yes and not forgetting a full 60K service and cam belt change not cheap.
None of this worked on my golf.
The only thing that has worked on my golf is the AA found that I was not getting enough power to the coil.
?52 pound for my local electrician to rewire the ignition to the coil.
This was done 2 weeks ago the car is running fine and I?m happy with it again
;D ;D ;D
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hmm so another person saying its coil related, good to hear :)
does anyone know the procedure for checking this.. would be nice so people dont blindly replace parts in the hope of a fix.
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My Driver used to cut out because the mini chip in the key was faulty and in turn kept making the immobiliser cut in and out. I took it to VW to get the key reprogrammed aswell as getting a spare just incase the original key goes faulty again :)
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hello
i have just been reading the thread and i had the same problem with my 97 gti 8v colour concept, i had the coil pack replaced and so far i havent had a problem and it has been running for 2 months.
however, i am losing confidence after reading some of your problems and it sounds very dangerous, i might try that carbon cleaner.
i wandered if anyone could help me out, im looking to get a K&N induction kit, but theres 2 types that are with hitachi Mass Air Sensor and the other is without, i havnt got a clue which is right for my car, any ideas?
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Skevas,
Funnily enough, I did clean my throttle body out on Sunday (with petrol) and the car has cut out since then, very dissapointing!
I also now have a fast idle at startup! Doh!
ALthough replacing Fuse 30 on my 8v cured the stalling problem later on it developed the stalling at traffic lights problem etc. I too cleaned my throttle bodies out, but with Ecotek Powerboost (www.ecotekplc.co.uk) and since then it has been fine. May be worth another go??
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1997 2.0 8V GTI Colour Concept
I've not noticed the oil light flashing, but i have experiened this intermittent attempt for the car to try and cut out. First time it happened and every time after that, only during acceleration.
It has only happened since i had the cam belt changed (by Stealth Racing). I queried this with Vince who reckons cam belt change was done completely correctly. If as one member suggested his cam belt was one notch out, i am wandering if i can check the timing with my timing gun and see if it is out.
Then the other day i had the car completely cut out. I never knew about waiting 2 minutes and trying again, so after trying a couple of times straight after it died, i had it towed back to my house, luckily only half a mile.
As i was about to check the HT lead off the coil with #1 spark plug, it started!!! So i put it back together and changed the Engine Management Relay (#3)
Since i have changed the relay, i thought that i may have solved the problem. Then when i was driving on the M6 (70mph) the following day, the car jolted and tried to cut out again, but it did not completely die. So now i have to decide if it is the Fuel Pump Relay (#12 i think) or / and the coil.
Can it be anything else?
i have read through most of this thread and it does appear i have the same problem, but i have changed the relay (2nd hand for ?5 from Sandburns in Cov)
Is it really worth buying a new one? i thought i would try 2nd hand since it was Saturday afternoon and i needed the car the following day (Sunday). If i buy a new relay, should i also buy the Fuel Pump Relay too? I'd rather just spend the few quid and change the potential faults rather than change one thing then try something else later.
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the other suggested solution is to clean the throttle body.
i don't know about for other people, but mine totally died when the coil went, and needed a new one to go again.
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I have just read the whole thread and to summerise the following have been mentioned as potential problems, some of which have solved the problem for some, but for others none have helped:
Engine Management Relay (#3)
Fuel Pump Relay (#12)
Hall Sender and/or complete dizzy
Speed Sensor
Ignition Switch
Coil
I think i will sell mine and buy something else. :-\
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I replaced the ECU relay with a brand spanker from the dealer (< ?10) and unfortunately, it cut out on me, in the middle lane on a busy set of traffic lights and i was in danger of being wacked up the behind by 40mph+ cars travelling along!!! I had my wife and son in the car and apart from being afraid for them, i was getting really pissed at the "If everything was as reliable as a Golf" slogan meaning f#ck all...
I am going to check the coli/transformer tonight, dealer charging ?100+VAT for part. Small price to pay in my situation.
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you missed throttle body from your list.
check the latest performance VW they explain -why- these things happen, the symptoms and how to fix.
PVW listed 3 causes, relay, coil and throttle body. throttle body is the cheapest..
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cheers. i'll have a look at pvw.
i have listed throttle body (on my website!) http://ajmerphull.com/vw/vw/html
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cool.. site needs a link to this one tho :P
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Having found this very useful resource I thought I might share my experiences of the problem everyone is experiencing. That is, intermittent cutting out with erratic revs at speed, with a warm engine and the oil light flashing.
The car in question is a Mk3 8v GTI 1997
I had previously (several months prior) had some problems with stalling when coming to a stop; this was correctly diagnosed as the throttle body becoming caked with carbon and appropriate measures were taken to fix this.
The new problem came as a bit of a shock some months later on the motorway and appeared to resolve spontaneously until it started to become more frequent.
On taking it to my VW main dealer it was, to my surprise, given a clean bill of health, a diagnostic check not returning any fault. The problem continued and I turned to this site for help.
I proceeded to replace the fuel pump end ECU power relays with no resolution.
I eventually took my car to Dubsport of Wrightington where the crank sensor came up as a fault on their diagnostic equipment. It was duly replaced and I'm glad to say that I haven't had any problems since, and now my car drives perfectly.
The moral of the story: Don't waste your time (and money) on VW main dealers
PS: An absolute gem of a forum! ;D
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my car used to stall and not start up right away, I took it to a garage and they kept fitting new parts and billing me it came to ?1000 in total b4 I got problem right even the garage in question ended up taking it to guilders (VW dealer) and it turned out to be a relay switch, when it got hot it cut out the engine at what ever speed i was doing!! I still might have the receipt somewhere with details on it? But it has started to do the again but this time it starts back up right away and it only cuts out when I dip the clutch I have replaced 2 worn and damaged breather hoses on top of the block which I thought would solve the problem but it hasn't so its back to the drawing boards!!!
cheers
Dean
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my car used to stall and not start up right away, I took it to a garage and they kept fitting new parts and billing me it came to ?1000 in total b4 I got problem right even the garage in question ended up taking it to guilders (VW dealer) and it turned out to be a relay switch, when it got hot it cut out the engine at what ever speed i was doing!! I still might have the receipt somewhere with details on it? But it has started to do the again but this time it starts back up right away and it only cuts out when I dip the clutch I have replaced 2 worn and damaged breather hoses on top of the block which I thought would solve the problem but it hasn't so its back to the drawing boards!!!
cheers
Dean
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Hi, wondered if anyone can help me cos i'm banging my head against a brickwall! ?>:(
I have a 1997 P reg gti 2.0l 8v and the problem i'm having is that the car keeps cutting out on me, it doesnt matter if i'm travelling at speed or not (infact its just happened while I was on the dartford crossing bridge at 5pm! very scarey) When it cuts out the oil light flashes and the rev counter goes straight to zero, now somtimes it will start straight away and somtimes it takes ages to start, when it doesnt start, the engine turns over as normal but the oil light flashes.
Now the first thing I checked was the Oil (duh!) But the oil is ok, when i take the oil filler cap of, there is presure there so I think the oil pump is ok, and I dont think its an oil problem cos if there was a problem surley it would do it all the time, somtimes its weeks before it would cut out and somtimes it does it several times a day! I once went to a party when I met a guy who is a salesman for vw, and he reckons its the hall effect sensor, now I dont know wether this is true, after all he just sells the dam things!
Please can anyone help me?
My Golf GTi 8v P reg cutting out but not starting back up right away, heres what VW dealer put on reciept-
Repaired wiring under bonnet area near control unit for ECU, had car running but stopped and loosing immobliser data info on start, replaced ECU and read coil, car starts ok but cuts out after 10mins, carried out checks as per wiring instruction, replaced supply relay for engine management started car and left running for 3 times 4 hour sessions all ok.
dunno if that helps?
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Newbie here. This is my tale of woe with a VR6 Golf which had the same problem - cutting out when slowing down, changing down approaching junctions etc.
First diagnosis by VW dealer led to the airflow meter being changed. Didn't work. However, it did drive fine with the airflow meter disconnected, so I did that in the meantime - only slight loss of power, but dealer said it was safe. Then went for a second opinion to an independent and had a new clean throttle body fitted and checked for leaks. Didn't work either. Then had the Impulse Sender (or Engine Speed sensor) changed. Nope, no joy there. Then started reading these threads about changing the ECU relay. At ?10, it was worth a go.
At first I was puzzled because the new ECU relay had "109" stamped on it. But there was nothing in the fusebox with the same number on it. I double-checked that it was supposed to slot into position 3, which I find to be vacant in my VR6? :shocked:
Eh. Imagine my surprise. I've been running a car for 5yrs (first 3yrs problem free) without an ECU relay. Do VR6's work without one, cos mine does.
Anyway, it hasn't stalled yet, but I've only driven 3 miles from the dealer to work. If this doesn't work, I'll try changing the Fuel Pump relay (No.167)
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Newbie here as well. I've had the same problem as mentioned before, it started cutting out once in a blue moon, but within the last 2 weeks it's got really bad.
First off the tacho was dropping out and the oil light coming on, so I changed the relay in position no3. Unfortunately it didn't sole the problem, it still cuts out, but it seems the tacho isn't dropping out now, and it can fire back up straight away whilst driving.
Today I had to get towed home as it cut out and I was stranded on a junction and wouldn't re-start. Got home after 30 mins, re-started by stalled idling after 10 seconds. The RAC man said it was likely the coil/igniter, even though this was changed 8 months ago. The has now stood for a few hours, started and idled until warm-ish, then died again on the drive. New coil (GSF - ?39+vat) didn't solve the problem.
I'm pretty familiar with engine management systems, but being intermittent it's hard to diagnose. Carbon in the throttle or airflow meter shouldn't make any difference as this seems to be related to spark, ie it's not present when it stalls and you try and re-start. The car starts with the air-flow meter detached - it stumbles initially, but I'm assuming the ECU then switches over to the throttle position sensor to read the engine load. The car runs and starts with the hall sensor detached on the distributor. This would tell the ECU when to fire each injector, without it it probably fires the injectors in 2 batches, so there's no difference without the Hall sensor. Detach the speed sensor (crank sensor, hidden away under the oil filter) and it does start.
So......who has had these problems and solved by the speed sensor? All other sensors wouldn't make the car stall by pulling the plug, and the air and water temperature may make the car hard to start but wouldn't make it stall. The fuel pump relay failing shouldn't cut the spark.
Finally, where is the diagnostic port on a 1997 P Reg 8v? The Haynes manual doesn't even cover the engine management system!
Thanks
Phil
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Update since my last post. Fitting the ECU relay (I didn't have one before!) has made no difference. I have also changed the Fuel Pump relay, but again no difference.
Oh well, at least that's two potential cures off my list. Might try and sell the impulse sender that was changed previously and fuel pump relay to recover some of the cost. They'll be appearing on a well-known online auction site near you very soon. Hopefully, they'll find a good home and cure someone else's faltering VW.
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The diagnostic port is behindthe small pannel to the left of the ashtray.
You have to remove the ashtray and then the pannel slides out to the right!
easy when you know how - very well hidden though!!!!
...where is the diagnostic port on a 1997 P Reg 8v? The Haynes manual doesn't even cover the engine management system!
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Thanks :wink:
Phil
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Can anyone help I have a VW Golf 2.0 8v MK3 Anniversary edition I'm having the exact issues I've changed the ECU relay, Air flow meter and still it cuts out at every junction. Oil light and battery light as soon as the car comes to a stand still. Its been to the garage and they reckon it needs the hall sender changing ( expensive) any ideas? Cheers
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Had the same problems on a MK3 P reg 8v, used this forum to sort it out. Changed the rotor arm, and the ECU relay to no avail. My mate's dad runs a garage, he cleaned the throttle body out (for ?50) and it hasn't cut out since. One garage I spoke to before this tried to get me to pay the diagnostic charge and wanted to replace the throttle body itself, which they said could cost up to ?600.
From what I can see, the best option is to get the throttle body cleaned if the rotor arm and the relay don't work, the arm wasn't that expensive and I got the relay for 8 quid. At least the body-clean is cheaper than some of the options, and seems to be the #1 solution. Thank God for this forum, I was going wappy with the damn thing cutting out all the time.
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cleaning the thottle body is really really easy.. you just need a squirty thing of carb cleaner (something like wynn's..) cost me about 6 quid i think..
u just loosen the circlip by the body and clean it all up... 50 quid? ouch!
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Just a quick update on my problem. I have datalogged the Speed Sensor as I though this may be the issue (after reading posts here). Nothing wrong with it and to be honest a magnet either works or it doesn't. I logged the power to the sensor to see if that was dropping out. Nope. I them measured the resistance of the Ground wire back to Chassis Ground. It was a whopping 4.5ohms, it should be 0.5ohms. I'm now looking for a Ground fault, which would make snse as the car plays up after it heats up (wires get too hot and the Ground trips out).
Just a note about the throttle body. A dirty TB would only make the car cut out when it's idling, not normal running.
Phil
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A quick fix for idling/stalling problems when coming to a stop. I had this last year and this worked a treat (although I didn't actually find the fault).
If the throttle plate closes completely, to idle the system relies on a idle valve to leak enough air past the throttle to keep it running. Clearly there is a problem somewhere and I took off the TB to inspect it. I couldn't see a passage way for air to go around a closed throttle and put the TB back. I didn't want to clean the TB as this has caused high idling problems as you can remove too much carbon and risk not having the throttle seal.
Not knowing the exact problem and course of action to take, I knew the car needed air to keep running, which in some cases it wasn't getting. My solution was to tighten the throttle cable at the support just before the TB, so when the cable was at rest the throttle plate was slightly open. this had the desired effect of no more stalling and it idled under 1000rpm. A few months later I went back and slacked the cable and it been fine ever since. May be the ECU has 'learned' the new position?
Phil
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hello!
im fairly new to the forum, having only purchased my shiny green sexed up gti 3weeks ago
but since that day it has had this exact same problem which was bugging the crap out of me.
i decided to start at the easiest place and work my way up! so i removed the pipe from the airbox to the
throttle unit. i noticed a tiny bit of gunk around the intake and with some carburater cleaner removed it.
decided to put it back together and take it for a spin just to be sure this wasn't the problem and incredably i couldn't
get her to stall :laugh: its been a week and its as smooth as silk.
i suggest everyone try this as it takes less than 5 mins and requires as much kill as your average cabbage can muster! :tongue:
anyway hope that helps someone
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IF you are running an AGG engine have a look at page 76 of the march issue of golf + theres a good paragraph on the old oil lamp cutting out engine problem.. :huh: :smiley:
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I have a 96 Preg GTI 8v it cuts out for about 2-5 mins then goes again, after reading all the replies on here
when it cut out just now i took relay no30 out it was red hot. so off to buy new one tomorrow,
It cant be fuel pump relay as I can here the pump go when u turn on the ignition.
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ok now i have changed relay 30 and fuel pump relay, swaped the dizzy and still doing it fcuking thing.
Help anyone......
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Kno how you feel mate mines just the same,fookin car it's the AGG engine it's a pile of shate mine was coutting out this morning and does it always at the garage even shows no faults on the vag-com so fook knows engine temp sensor maybe another one of those hit and miss electrical probs very frustrating.. :angry: :angry:
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While changing my distributer i noticed that if you unplug the small plug to the Hall Sensor
the engine will start and run..
Is this normal
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Months of messing around with the golf as of this moment the car is running better than it has in a long wile.
Spent 2 hours cleaning out the throttle body and left it to soak in a good layer of WD40 for 30 minuets.
This has stopped the car from stalling and the fuel economy has gone up a bit.
I have been driving it hard trying to get the thing to stall not stalled yet.
:grin: :grin: :grin: :evil:
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Its not the TB it doesn't stall as you say it cuts out like turning the ignition off,
it even does this with my foot flat down doing 80 it justs stops
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I know its a while ago but did you ever get it sorted out as mine is doing the same
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woodymk3_8v
went through all this when it last packed not just stalling i posted all this a long time ago
might help??
Went through the usual c**p local vw dealer came back with no suggestions.
Changed plugs, ht leads distributor cap, rotary arm no change.
I Changed relay No: 30 and it made the thing worse.
Cleaned out the air flow and throttle body.
Oh yes and not forgetting a full 60K service and cam belt change not cheap.
None of this worked on my golf.
The only thing that has worked on my golf is the AA found that I was not getting enough power to the coil.
?52 pound for my local electrician to rewire the ignition to the coil.
This was done 2 weeks ago the car is running fine and I?m happy with it again
;D ;D ;D
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Hi, wondered if anyone can help me cos i'm banging my head against a brickwall! ?>:(
I have a 1997 P reg gti 2.0l 8v and the problem i'm having is that the car keeps cutting out on me, it doesnt matter if i'm travelling at speed or not (infact its just happened while I was on the dartford crossing bridge at 5pm! very scarey) When it cuts out the oil light flashes and the rev counter goes straight to zero, now somtimes it will start straight away and somtimes it takes ages to start, when it doesnt start, the engine turns over as normal but the oil light flashes.
Now the first thing I checked was the Oil (duh!) But the oil is ok, when i take the oil filler cap of, there is presure there so I think the oil pump is ok, and I dont think its an oil problem cos if there was a problem surley it would do it all the time, somtimes its weeks before it would cut out and somtimes it does it several times a day! I once went to a party when I met a guy who is a salesman for vw, and he reckons its the hall effect sensor, now I dont know wether this is true, after all he just sells the dam things!
Please can anyone help me?
wow!!!!!! Did i just post that! totaly the same thing is happening to my car, and the same car aswell 1997 P reg gti 2.0l 8v
can someone let us know what the end solution was to fixing this?
any info most apperciated
many thanx
Ben
:smiley:
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NRS1,
Is there any chance you could add a bit more detail to what you had the auto leccy do to your car
"?52 pound for my local electrician to rewire the ignition to the coil".
Mine has been playing up for ages now and it on the verge of being part-exchanged unless i can fix it soon. It died on me about an month ago as usual, but wouldn't restart. AA came out and dignosed that the regulator on the coil was funked. As always you cant change that part on it own so i had to change the whole coil unit at ?90. It fixed the immediate problem, but the car still has the same old intermittent problem (stutters, then cuts out. It resarts fine and then pretends that nothing has happend... unitll next time).
Im not to clued up on how the ignition is wired to the coil. Any details so i can have a chat to my local leccy about it would be greatly appresiated!!!
Cheers,
Frogs!
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When the car packed in and the bloke from the AA had a look he thought that the immobiliser had packed in after a bit longer he told me that there was no enough power getting to the coil he ran a lead straight from the battery had to fit a fuse to stop the engine but got me home.
Posted this some time back
Talking to my local friendly electrician and he told me if the thing starts cutting out check to see if the coil is getting enough volts (12.4v is about right) golf was only getting 6-7 volts.
It?s not always the coil that is faulty but the wiring braking down
rewired the thing for me not a fun job so I just paid him to do it.
if you can get some one to run a tester over the wiring round the coil it might bring up the problem with out costing too much
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The old 8v did it's usual trick this morning went shopping comes up to the busiest roundabout in town and the fker died on me had to get a push to the road side caused a major roadblock.. :evil: :laugh:
first im going to put a new relay ecu relay 30 in as theres no faults on the vag-com .I changed this last year for a so called new one which it seems is faulty.. :angry: 90% of cases according to the golf+ can be cured by doing this make sure its a grey relay 30 not a black one made in malasia as these are crap and prone to breakage apparently.?10:80 from vw for a new one thats if they have them in which as usual they didn't,so the car is now off the road until friday. :angry:
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:( gutted for ya mate, Hope its sorted fro newark :grin:
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Try changing the ECU Relay position no3 pt no 16590638y, this cured mine of the same problem and cost me less than a tenner.
bthornell
Just changed mine again this morning, relay 30 cost me ?11:32 from VW and this one was made in Germany and the problem seems to have been solved boots up no problems now had no cutting out no stalling at all test driving it this morning.
:grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: Good old german car parts? :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
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Got a 97P that cuts out "sometimes" but only on the down change and always in 2nd doesnt matter whether its up hill at Round abouts or down hill always re starts, is this also the Hall Sensor? :undecided:
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Mine does the same thing, went to VW to get a #30 relay. First the guy couldn't find the part # for it, so i had to take the one out of the car to show him. Then he tells me theres none in stock. The one i have i the car is a black one made in germany. When i put the relay back in, the car fired up straight away :smiley: (Think because it had time to cool down) and drove excellent for a while, then went back to normal? :sad: , think the relay may be getting too hot.
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^ too hot?
plenty of power sources in a fusebox.. time to wire up a cheap 12v PC type cooling fan in there?
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So if i get this right 1. i have to replace the#30 Relay and 2.Install a small PC fan? Fuse box doesnt seem that hot too me! :rolleyes:
is there a part number for this Relay or will it only be available thru VW?
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At last its resolved had mine on the diagnostic check it was coming up with the hall sender code it turns out to be the cam shaft sensor ?60 replaced it now running like a dream 2weeks not a problem hope it helps
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VW part number for the 30 ecu relay is 165 906 381 make sure it's made in germany and is a grey colour one ..?11:32 from VW.
Mines running like a top now and the fuel consumption problem seems to have sorted itself as well now getting 36 mpg was getting 29.8mpg.. :grin: :grin: :grin:
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Thanks Guys for the info will replace my one ASAP and see how we go :grin: hopefully this car (our first VW) will get some good miles under its belt
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got a #30 relay yesterday from ECP ?10.03 Gray and made in germany. Put it in and it drove like a dream? :grin:. Straight away i could the difference, car felt smoother, queiter and more responsive.Also the mpg went up to 36 from 30.
However, this morning on the way to school (dropping the kids off) it cut out again? :cry: and the mpg stayed at 30.
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I had a problem with the MAF causing juddering on my P reg GTI 2.0 8V for about 3 months, and in the last month of this, it also started to cut out when I stopped at traffic lights, etc. I changed the MAF yesterday, which fixed the judder, but the stalling still remains.
I don't get the oil light coming on, and it never stalls at speed, so I think I can count out the relay. However, would I be correct in assuming that running with a knackered MAF for 3 months may mean that my throttle body is probably caked up with crap? I'm going to try and give it a clean out in a min, although I don't really know where to start...
I'll try and get some photos!
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Maybe you guys can help me my 8v mk3 GTi cuts out when cold if left at idle. Sometimes its okay on start up but very rarely. Can be quite dangerous when you dip the clutch at a roundabout in rush hour traffic as you lose all power steering when the car stalls.
The fault goes when warm any ideas relay etc???
(there is no fault code)
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i cleaned the throttle body the other day and so far it drives ok :grin:. So i would suggest doing that first as it wont cost anything apart from time and effort!!
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My P Reg 16V is juddering in normal driving, sounds like gavcradd's problem, can someone tell me what a MAF is, and where do I get one? Thx
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Got the Grey relay 30 fitted and idle speed now stays nailed at 1000RPM however short drive later cold engine slowing dowm in second cut out revs dip away needle bounces and ignition lights come on
Ant other ideas anyone also What does IN02 mean is that the Service indicator?
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my mate who was a vw tecnician a few years ago had the same problem on his vr6,he replaced all the ususal items to no avail,he eventialy traced the problem back to the oil presure switch on the oil pump.
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Hi all
after reading the this thread (and the ones linked 2 it) i now have a list of several things it could be that cause this cutting out issue....
Of them i have changed the ECU relay, to no avail (car cut out on breaking 2hrs after installing it)
I was wondering what to try next as im not keen on getting ripped off by VW - especially as they dont really seem to know the actual source of the problem...
there seems to be a good shout for this Ecotek power boost or cleaning the throttle body..? just wondering if anyone has actually ever fully solved the problem...?
cheers
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Hi all
after reading the this thread (and the ones linked 2 it) i now have a list of several things it could be that cause this cutting out issue....
Of them i have changed the ECU relay, to no avail (car cut out on breaking 2hrs after installing it)
I was wondering what to try next as im not keen on getting ripped off by VW - especially as they dont really seem to know the actual source of the problem...
there seems to be a good shout for this Ecotek power boost or cleaning the throttle body..? just wondering if anyone has actually ever fully solved the problem...?
cheers
clean the throttle body outwere the butterfly open,s and shut,s. my +car used to stall at every junction cleaned it out and it,s been fine ever since
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Mine used to stall at every junction aswell :cry:, i cleaned the around the butterfly in the throttle body by just using kitchen towel. It took about 5 mins. It hasn't stalled since :grin:.
Try cleaning the throttle body before spending £'s on Ecotek!!
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:sad:
I've had a very similar problem with my Golf 1.6 GL (R reg)
It cuts out intermittently and usually starts again after a few minutes. The oil light comes on when this happens but I think that is a red herring.
I've noticed people on this thread mention changing the ECU relay or the Hall sender relay. This is something I will try soon and will post the outcome on here.
If anyine has any other idea's on the subvject that would be great.
P.S where is the best place to get these parts? VW?
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I have changed everything on mine n its still doing it.just changed dizzy.still cutting out gettin it put on computer to see if any faults come up on ecu.cuts out most wen ya restart car starts n cuts out sounds like its starvin of fuel so gonna get fuel pump tested for pressue n that.all a wud say is get it put on computer first n see if faults come up cos ave spent a fortune changing everything that usually comes up wen this problem is mentioned
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you loose oil pressure when the revs drop too low and stall , that might explain why the light comes on, mine used to flicker at junctions when the revs dropped.
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I've got an 8v Gti which I love and has hardly had any probs since I bought it 5 years ago :cool:. But recently it's been doing the occasional stall thing at junctions :angry:. I reckon it's gotta be a fuel problem, so I'll check all the hoses and clean the throttle body over the weekend and see if that works.
I don't have any cut-out problems (yet), but it sounds to me like this has got to be electrical. Does anyone have the Haynes Fault Codes manual? Is it any good for the Golf? I'm keen to try and understand a bit more about the ECU stuff before it starts playing up!
Just wanted to say cheers to everyone for all the advice here; really great forum.
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HI all, just thought I d add my ten cents worth.
I had this problem with my 95 gti 8v power would cut out for 5-6 seconds then resume working without having to restart oil light flashing etc. searched the web found this site and saw this thread, so i replaced the ecu relay £10.49 inc which cured my problem so many thanks here to all.
Just a final note, once I had the new relay I knew which one was the old one etc, so I opened the old relay and found a dry joint on the circuit board for the relay throw, this has been repaired and works fine, still this isnt something I would of done without knowing what was at fault, worth a look thought.
cheers
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:santa: Hi everybody, and WOW I would of never believed that when I started this thread ooo way back in 2003, that it would of grown this BIG!!! and it is still at the top! well I think I should deserve a prize!! Is this the biggest thread?
well I suppose this proves how good and succesful this forum really is, I hope that everybody has benifited from this thread, I hear all the time with people with the same problem, I have even replace friends gti's relays! well I still have the car, and it hasnt cut since replacing the relay, now the wife has the car and I now have a '95 gti 16v!
I wish everybody a happy christmas and a bloody good new year!
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Hi Mate,
I Know exactly what your'e going through....I Had the exactly same problem on my P-reg 2.0ltr GTI where the car would start up okay..then at any particular time the oil light would flash and revs would hit zero and cut engine out....Very dangerous if cars are up your arse!!!
After going backward and forwards to garage several times, replacing all plugs,Ht,Dizzy,Rotar arm, Injection cables, Oil sensor, Relays etc.....I Finally took my GTI to an idependant VW/Audi Car specialist and put GTI on his VW Dealer Diagnistic machine....It diagnosed the CRANK SENSOR as the problem...this cost me £145 from Dealers...as he would only fit Genuine Vw parts...however I Believe you can get the part for around £50 non genuine..so far so good, no more embarrassing cut out at main juctions for me!!!.....Hope this info helps...and good luck...Rob.
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hi, my wifes p reg 8v gti has the CUT OUT WHEN SLOWING TO STOP FAULT ,and WILL RESTART STRAIGHT AWAY every time. The idle used to go low some times so before discovering your site i had a play as im a jeep tech by trade and noticed that the breather was blocked so cleaned out and wiped out the THROTTLE BUTTERFLY while the pipe was off ... the idle is almost perfect now but it happened to me the other day (after i did this ) and im pretty certain i was in second gear Am i correct by trauling this thread that a good dose of cleaner in the throttle body USUALLY cures this ??
Does this need to be removed to perform this or can it be done effectively in place ??????
Also Am i correct that relay 30 isnt a factor in this .............. but for a tenner i suppose i should replace anyway !!!!
GREAT SITE , by the way .....Rob
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Hi Mk3gtirob, no ur wifes car isnt the relay 30 problem! but it is a good idea to replace it, i believe that the original relays from vw were of crap quailty, they have now changed supplier and they are of a different colour! but the problem u described is a breather/throttle body problem, just clean the throttle body of carbon so the butterfly shuts properly and make sure all the pipes are free of gunge and are not split, even a little split will stop it from running well!!
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:grin: hi just wanted to add my two penneth worth.... i have had all the symptoms listed here ... but hadnt a clue about this site... i got ill advised that i may be a problem with my immobilisor making the car cut out .. so forked out almost 300 quid on a new alarm. 2 weeks went by then the problem re arrose. i then changed th H.T leads dizzy cap plugs, then changed the coil at a cost of £120!!!!! but it did not stop the cutting out.
i then read this thread and firstly changed the fuel pump relay ( about £14) but it didnt solve the problem!! then i changed the hall sensor relay .. i specified the part number listed earlier in this thread ........ :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: almost four weeks and not one cut out !!!! which has meant a quiet wife :grin: :grin: so try it or if you havent changed it .... change the relay
cheers Gaz
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BOY AM I GLAD IVE FOUND THIS SITE!!!!!
Ive had the cutting out at speed with oil light on for about 3 weeks. Spent £239 pounds on all sorts. Stuck a no 30 ecu relay in the beast and WOW! Use to cut out at least twice a day, now zeroville. I recommend any one with a 97 2.0 8v with this problem to get a relay yesterday. Very happy at the moment but realize it could all be different tomoz.
I will keep you informed.
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ive got a mk3 2.0 8v that was cutting out like a rite pain in the arse and i cleaned out all the breathers which were blocked with gammy oil and now its been mint ever since, i did it about 5 months ago! i would suggest to clean out the breathers before spending money on parts or diagnostics! (i have a diagnostic machine should anyone be local to stoke on trent :wink:)[/color]
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Morning Chaps,
Well firstly, congratulations scooterist on a mamouth and evidentally very popular post.
Joined this forum today specifically to reply to this post.
I also have started suffering with the whole 8v gti cutting out problem. It happens when accelerating, decelerating, or stationary completely at random (but more prominently when she's had a good thrashing).
Was worried it was going to be another of those lots of hours/lots of money fixes, but this thread seems to be the proverbial light at the end of a tunnel.
I'll get a new sensor as soon as is possible and get the results on here.
Just a quick side point, has everybody else's driver's side front seat mounting broken in the back right corner leading to a wonky seat?? I'm on my second Mk3 now and it's happened in both..... and before the chants of pies pies he do love his pies start flooding through...... I don't like pies.
Cheers for going to the trouble of getting all this info on here.
B4rks.
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just ad same probs.ad engine idle sensor replaced.not cheap 88 nipa.but ok now...needs 2 go on diagnostic machine. to find problem.or look for sensor just below oil filter,wires may b broken due to heat from manifold. b lucky :grin:
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Brought a P reg Golf GTI a few weeks ago, very impressed with it until I got the dreaded cutting out problem!
It cut out occasionally including on the motorway! Changed the No 30 relay but it was still cutting out.
Went to work on Friday, 30 miles down motorway all ok, got off motorway and it then started cutting out every 2 minutes!
Called the RAC out as I was getting nowhere and didn't fancy driving 30 miles on the motorway home with the car cutting out every 2 mins! RAC man came to the conclusion it was the coil, changed it and we tested it down to the next motorway junction and back, all was fine or so I thought!
Went home and 2 mins away from my house it cut out again and then every 10 yards!
Put it on my mates computer at garage today and its coming up with the crank sensor being the problem. Will get one from VW on tuesday and report back how it goes....!!
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Hi
I said I,d get back to you people about the no 30 relay replaced in my 97 GTI. Well its been close on 2 months now and she drives superb. I think I,ve just struck lucky, cos I know its not worked for some of you guys/gals.
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To anyone who is reading this post....
It worked for me too :)
Replaced the ECU relay for £10.57 and had no problems since. Highly recommended as a first point of call if you're having these errors. My idle valve is shot too, but replacing the ecu relay has stopped all cutting out (except when the revs drop quickly from 5k+ (but this is due to the idle valve))
So glad I found this post.
Thanks for your help chaps.
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I had to px my 95gti due to this problem costing me over 1000 quid to put right with no fix changed the
Coil HT leads and plugs
new dizzy
crank speed sensor
cleaned and checked all sensors and throttle body
new o2 sensor
VW main dealer never mentioned the relay just kept charging me to plug in the computer :angry:
got a mk2 now much better
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Hi All,
having a nightmare with my Golf GTI 8V MkIII 1997.
Symptoms:
1] Began to cut-out whilst driving around the roads in town i.e upto 30mph.Oil light flashes.
2] Central locking packed in - pump works but no central locking occurs
3] Had throttle cleaned out but cut-out occurred again within 10 days.
4] Cut out whilst doing 80mph on the motorway.
5] More intermittant cut-outs from 5mph to 35 mph.
6] Now it won't start.Very hot day.
And in-between all this, the power-steering pipe burst requiring a tow home.
Now that the fault is always there rather than intermittant, here are the things I've checked so far:-
1] Relay 30 checked for it working with passing 12v across it = ok.
2] Had a working coil put in place off my partners working polo (same coil) = no difference/no start
3] Checked for 12V+supplying coil = ok
4] Checked for spark on centre HT lead but doesn't seem to be one present, also checked for a spark at one of the plugs. This was done placing a timing light in series, but it didn't light up. Not sure if I was doing this correctly though as I passed 12V from battery across it and couldn't get a light on even then.
5] Put a working HT lead in place from the coil and checked for spark = no spark
6] Cleaned distribution cap as all 4 contacts were furry.
7] Replaced dissy rotor arm with new one.
8] Bought a new ECU Realy No 30 from VW - fitted it and it started YIPPEE.
9] Put the old relay back in - just to check it wasn't a fluke - and that worked also?????????
I am now going to see what happens, I'll drive it about and let you know. The temperature of the day is a good 8 degrees less than it has been over the past week or so and it makes me wonder if it has had an effect. I will run the car up to temp and update soon.
Until then.........................fingers crossed.
Jules
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Julee, I haven't really got anything that will help you out, but I've been experiencing a very similar sort of thing (This ECU relay business in a royal pain in the ass)....
As my previous posts stated my Mk3 gti 8v was cutting out intermitantly, and after advice from this forum I bought a new ECu relay, and had no further problems up until about a week ago.
Then, the exact same thing happened again, driving along in 4th at about 45mph, and the old girl started judering, oil and water temperatures were both normal but it was a very hot day. I've permanently removed the fuse board cover so I reached down (can now feel and replace the 30 relay without looking ;)) and it was so hot that it was painful to keep my finger on it. Pulled over to the side of the road, and as I dipped the clutch it cut out. I keep a spare 30 relay in the glove box now so swapped them over, turned the key and off she went again purring like a kitten..... The same thing has happened again since, the relay seems to give me about 40 - 45 minutes of driving time then overheats, swap it for a 'chilled' relay and all's good - so I'm now not getting stranded anywhere but it is annoying cutting out in traffic and having to swap it, looking like a turkey.
My idle valve is on the way out so I don't know if the two are connected in some way, but there's obviously some electrical malfunction somewhere that's causing the ECU relay to overheat.
Anyway, just thought I'd write down my findings incase anybody else can shed further light, or worst case just to let all you 30 relay dubbers out there know you're not alone.
Looking to upgrade to a VR6 in a couple of months cos my 8ver has lost my trust entirely, just hope these don't experience the same problem or i'll be flying out to VW HQ (wherever that is) and giving the first person that walks out the door a proper kicking.
B4.
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:smiley: Give em a kick fer me also!!!! :wink: :wink: :wink:
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99 [357-955-531] Front Wipers
72 [191-955-529] Rear Wipers
30 [165-906-381] ECU
36 [3A0-951-307] BUZZER
18 [191-937-503] load reduction relay
Apparently this part number is not used anymore (PN now is :7m0951253A)
53 [141-951-253B] Horn
21 [191-953-227A] Indicators
167 [191-906-383C] Fuel Pump
Relay position
[72][30][18][ ][21]
[99][36][ ][53][167]
||||||||||||||||||||| <------ fuse panel
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mjoe,
is that the fuse board layout for a mk3 gti 8v as well???
In mine my ECU '30' relay is to the right of centre....... I wonder if that's why the problem is happeneing!!!!????
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Hi, This is one huge Thread, god bless the internet eh !!
So I've a 96 GTI 8V horse or a machine, I'm have this engine cut problem and I will fix it god dam it!
Firstly , I think there are two main "known" problems being talked about on this Thread.
A/ Engine cuts out a low revs or when idling
B/ Engine cuts at any rev, cuts out like it was shot, and the oil light comes on
Problem A/
is most likely a dirty Ttottle Body, and / or Breather pipe may be blocked with gunk and even frayed a bit. There is a posting on this forum with a detailed description on how to carry out the cleaning, listed tools, diagrams included, it's a fantastic posting, I did the work on my car a few months ago, and it completly solved that problem. i.e. problem a/ :)..
[I can't find this posting at the moment, but I'll put a link up if I do]
Problem B/
I'm having this issue at present, and I've begun the list of suggested fix's, I've already
(i) Replace the ECU Relay no30 or my car PN: 165 906 381
NO CHANGE TO THE ISSUE
(ii) I've just replaced the fuel pump Relay no. 167 PN 191 906 383C
WAITING TO SEE IF IT REPEATS
I will post an update soon, if the fuel pup relay is not the case then, I'll move onto the other suggestion posted.
Many thanks !!!!
N
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hi again..
I've psted that TB cleaning instructions under
"how to clean the Trottle Body"
Thanks to who ever originall wrote it!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I hope this other engine cut problem will be solved also..
thansk again !!
N
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don't we all mate!! But i've now become so efficiant at changing the ecu relay that i can do it whilst driving (let the engine cut out, and while coasting swap em over then bump start the old girl!!)
But that still doesn't help out with why it's overheating in the first place......
Only got to last me till october then i'm upgrading to a mk2gti16v :)
Much better.
Good luck all
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@ N_GTI_96
Any developments with the fuel pump relay yet m8?
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AAAAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !
Mine's gone from cutting out momentarily a few months ago, to doing it regularly at random intervals. Tearing my bloody hair out. Had to wait around 40mins for it to 'fix' itslef last night. When it used to cut out i could turn the engine over but it wouldn't catch. Leave it 10mins and it would fire up. Changed the coil, Hall senser. worked fine for a while. But it's progressed to something new now. Cut out on me last night, Oil light came on, then when i tried to start up - absolutely nothing. No lights on the dash, no charge going to the starter, nothing. left it for a while (40mins), then - no problem.
I've swapped no. 30 relay, new fuel pump relay and was about about to replace the crank sensor (can you get to it without undoing the engine mount?) but figured it might be a problem with the immobilizer. That might explain why i can't even turn it over. Has anyone else had their immobilizer looked at? Can anyone stop me falling into this eternal pit of despair....please... :)
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Just to add my 2 pennies, my beast was running oddly this morning. I noticed when I started it up it wouldn't idle. But I could restart straight away, if I kept the throttle pressed a bit. Every time I let off though, it was stalling. At junctions etc...
After 5 mins, the car was warm enough to idle very low (850rpm) so I tested the aircon - normally, when it's switched on the revs rise a bit, this time they went down a bit. Seems like the car's 'anti stalling' thing isn't working.
So after reading this here, I'll see if I can get a #30 relay and clean the TB out. But I do have to say I don't feel like it's a TB issue, as it's started doing it for the first time. Not gradual - it was fine yesterday...
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Now then. When I operate the air con my revs drops by approx 200 and it wants to stall. But then it just picks up and idles at 650ish. Is this normal or should the revs rise? By the way I had all this stalling and cutting out stuff. I was pulling my hair out, spent sh!t loads of cash and then the no. 30 relay sorted mine. I know what you are going thru, you just don't trust the thing and are just waiting for it to happen. And you just know its going to do it at the worst place/location you can ever want!!!!!!
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Hahahaaa! Well, I think I've threatened the car with a bit of jiggery pokery and it's not doing it now. I kid you not, the bu66er's right as rain. Just to be on the safe side, I bought a relay today (was £10.89 all in) from Main Stealer.
But, my aircon makes the revs dip ever so slightly until the 'automatic anti stall' kicks in and the revs go up to about 1100 on idle. Normal idle is 900ish. :smiley:
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Appologies b4rks,
your right, the # 30 relay is to the right of centre (top) - should have double checked before posting !! :shocked:
hope this has not caused inconvience to anyone !
rgds.,
mjoe
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I cant spell either. :embarassed:
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Wahey, changed the crank sensor (which was worn through - exposing the wiring) and it hasn't cut out since (touch wood). Pricey job as it's stuck behind the front engine mount but if the ECU relay doesn't do the trick, check the crank sensor.
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:laugh: Hey Everyone..... Been following this post for about 4 weeks as i have the same problem with my MK3 2.0ltr 8v GTi........ but its finally been fixed!!
I replaced the ECU,Fuel and Releif Relays! cleaned the throttle body, changed crank sensor, and still the same problem!
BUT FINALLY..... I took it to a friend who is a VW/AUDI SPecialist! he did all of the above work on the cheap as he had never seen the problem before! he checked everything and finally he found the problem!
When the Ignition it on start it sends an electrical surge to the fuse and relay box..... hence causing the realys to overheat! this can be fixed by just replacing the relays if the surge wasnt too bad! but like on my car this surge quite big and was also caused by faulty parts on the starter motor!
Repalced the starter motor parts and now its fine!
I will get a list of parts that were replaced by the end of the week!
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Hello everyone
My 1992 Golf VR6 has the same cutting out problem, but no oil light comes on unless it cuts out at a junction. It splutters when im driving then kicks back into life. Then a new one yesterday , when stopping before i turned engine off it tried to die then shot back into life upto about 1500 revs :cry:
Will these relays be worth trying on mine, or is it just 8v
Its had a new cranck sensor and new fuel pump relay, i also cleaned the throttle body, a new lamba probe.
Help
Thanks
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okay, I know this is an old thread and I know it's probably not read all that much but this is seriously driving me mad, how can VW let this happen?
I've replaced relay 30 with the grey one, replaced 167 with a new one. It's still doing it. It's an embarassment to go anywhere as it keeps cutting out and refusing to start. Sitting at the roadside for ten minutes.
I start uni again in two weeks and without this I'm doomed. I've got a 97 colour concept with an AGG engine, I'm assuming it's just on this and I can't really afford to go the path of replacing everything.
it's not the throttle body or the breather pipes as I've cleaned out both of these thoroughly. I cleaned the dizzy cap, rotor arm, these were kinda filthy but this did nothing. There is a spark coming from the HT's. The plugs have been replaced recently, about 1k ago.
I'm thinking that someone may actually be onto something when they say the oil pressure sensor hidden behind the oil filter, surely this would explain the oil light coming on and it only happening when it reaches a certain temperature ?
My relay 30, not the old nor the new has never been excessively hot and changing it did nothing. It's only cutting out when I'm driving it, not when it's left to idle as then it's rising up and not proving any issues.
This is really stressing me out and I'd appreciate any help given, I'm really loosing hope in my car. I've done 10k in it since I bought it so my saving grace is that I know I probably didn't buy it with this problem, should I check the wires or anything at the sensors? Where are they located? Should I kick myself hard. I love my car, I'm not going to part with it, I just wish it would show me the same kind of love back.
Rich
P.S. For good measure, here is the machine of love.
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y300/angelus1701/d921729b.jpg)
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Thanks to everyone on this site...
Just replaced ECU relay (the one with a big '30' on it) as mentionted in the above posts...
sorted my problem straight away. Only cost me a tenner too!
My car still occasionally dies at idle but that's because the injection system and sensors need cleaning.
Do you think maybe the strain of stalling at cold might have caused the relay to fail?
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After posting that yesterday, I drove home with no problems at all...
then the little f**k*r did it again, this time on a very busy part of the A3 in london with no tossing hard shoulder. managed to coast off the road into a car park and started it again, then revved it until it heated up. It seems to be okay now, but that was the last straw...
I'm buying a Honda S2000 instead! :angry:
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Bollocking twit Minge Arsey sh!te!!!
It wasnt that relay at all.
Just took my car to a VW specialist with a diagnostic machine...
Three sensors were malfunctioning, the ECU heat sensor (or something), the airflow meter and worst of all the crankshaft position sensor. Its going to cost me £340 f**king smackers to get it fixed. I hate VWs they're sh!t. :sick:
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I bought a crankshaft sensor for 40 quid, took five minutes to change.
go to ecp, get one and fit it yourself.
Rich
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its definatley the ecu relay my 97 2.0 8v did exactly the same i could be driving at 60 mph and it just cuts like u said then some times it started staight away or it would take ages vw have renewed the ecu relay to a different colour now so u will now if u have a old one on it sorted mineno problems now :grin:
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Hi there,
I had the same problem on an MK3 GTi AGY/ AGG engine like yours (I guess) I also cleaned the throttle body and replaced the fuel pump relay and starter relay as they mention on other post, also changed the part that feeds the dizzy which is in front of the driver side in the engine bay(passenger side in the UK, sorry but don´t know the name in english. If none of those things solve the problem (as they are afordable and wont hurt to replace them always from scrapper of course) you should go straight to a sensor that is by the oil filter, it is called engine speed sensor or something like that, I had to replace that and also check my ECU which needed some serious check, I found a mechanic that opened it and fixed it instead of repairing it which is the usual thing at least in Spain. The bill was 450 euros... Hope it helps and sorry if i didn´t make myself clear as english is not my mother tongue.
Cheers from Madrid
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Hi there,
I had the same problem on an MK3 GTi AGY/ AGG engine like yours (I guess) I also cleaned the throttle body and replaced the fuel pump relay and starter relay as they mention on other post, also changed the part that feeds the dizzy which is in front of the driver side in the engine bay(passenger side in the UK, sorry but don´t know the name in english. If none of those things solve the problem (as they are afordable and wont hurt to replace them always from scrapper of course) you should go straight to a sensor that is by the oil filter, it is called engine speed sensor or something like that, I had to replace that and also check my ECU which needed some serious check, I found a mechanic that opened it and fixed it instead of repairing it which is the usual thing at least in Spain. The bill was 450 euros... Hope it helps and sorry if i didn´t make myself clear as english is not my mother tongue.
Cheers from Madrid
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Hello all
I canÂ’t believe how long this thread has been open, I hope that there are still people viewing it. If you are please help me if you can. I have a mk3 2.0 golf GTi N (95), I am having the same problem as almost everyone in this thread my golf is cutting out and the oil light is flashing but I have one major difference. This is happening when I start the car not whilst driving. The car starts and revs up to just under 2000rpm and then dies. I can sometimes get round this by putting some oil in but there is already too much in there and I am starting to worry. Thank you in advance your help is greatly appreciated.
PS. Sorry if this has already been mentioned I have read most of the updates but there are 19 pages worth!!!
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Hi, wondered if anyone can help me cos i'm banging my head against a brickwall! >:(
I have a 1997 P reg gti 2.0l 8v and the problem i'm having is that the car keeps cutting out on me,
Did you find out what the problem was? mines also p reg golf gti 2.0l 8v and has been doing the same thing as yours for few months now, even at 60 mph. we've taken in to two garages n they couldnt fix it but suggested changing distributer and coil. we changed both and its still cutting out when driving. Also used the diagnostic machine but didnt show any faults. Please let me know if you found out what the problem was?
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i had a similar problem, i spent loads on mine before taking it to an auto electician, who reported that there were two faults, an immobilzier fault (the standard vw one) you will find an earth wire under where the fuse box is, check it. Take it off and put it back on again. and also the crank shaft speed sensor went on mine too, there are so many things it could be though, my advice from my expeirience is take it to an expeirienced auto electrician,mk 3s are to old for vw diagnostics to report all faults. hope this helps.
ian
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if it's not the relay. I'd seriosly say change the crank angle sensor.
I tried everything on mine. This was the last port of call. It was the right one.
Rich
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:sad: An interesting post this one, as ive just bought a 2.0 Gti golf, 4 days ago from a private seller, looked for one for ages to get a mint low miler, and spent everything i had on it, and ive had it 4 days and its broken down every day since i got the bugger.
my breakdowns are same symtoms as previously posted.
1, 1st time it conked out i was on my home with it, 10 miles out and it died, but fuel was low and i thought it was that, happend at 30mph.
2, 2nd time i had it ticking over on the drive for 10 or 15 mins or so, and it just stopped dead, while i was tuning my radio in. wouldnt re start so i left it 10 mins and it started straight up.
3, 3rd time it happened i was just pulling ito work, and it died again but restarted straight up this time.
4, 4th time tonight on way home from work it just died at 60 mph on the duel carridge way, had to pull over and, it did'nt restart for 30 secs or so then was fine rest of way home.
ive checked the relay, number 30 and its a black unit, made in malasia or somewhere and has 12/96 on it might be manifactured date, my car is a 98 R reg gti, mk 3 8v.
So it looks like i will be going to my dealers for a relay tomorrow, and possibly ECP for a crank position sensor and just fit the lot in one go, my wife is refusing to drive it and i am getting major ear ache as she wanted a focus, and i said vee dubs are more reliable.
i hope this things fix it or its getting flooged or burnt out.
anyway nice being on board guys and girls.
Rob :undecided:
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:smiley: Just thought i would post my results for you guys, went to VW yesterday and ordered a new relay, and it came in today, at a price of £8.14. all in.
Now the old relay was the blacke maylasia made relay, and the new one is a made in germany grey one.
Ok i fitted the relay and have been out helping my mate out collecting sales stock for his garage it was an ideal time to use the car to crack on a few miles, so i am glad to report after 171 miles done today the car never missed a beat.
So its looking good, touch wood, i opened the old relay and could see nothing un toward.
Just thought i would pass on my results, will keep you informed over the next few weeks or so.
Cheers :smug:
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:sad: Hi everyone this is my first time to the site, I have a 97P 2.0 8v Gti that is also suffering with the same cutting out problems. Oil light flashes revs drop to zero and the car cuts out. So far in the last 3 weeks i have replaced the coil pack, plugs, and leads. Still not cured, had a diagnostic test that showed no faults. Mechanic changed the ignition switch all was well for 400 miles then cut out again in fast lane M6. Took it back and had retest which showed intermittent fault on the speed sensor (crank). My car is not fitted with this so the equivalent is the Hall sensor within the distributor, had the whole thing replaced and a new fuel relay just for good measure. Just travelled 250 miles on the motorway with no problems, went back out on my way to the VW garage for a new ECU relay and it cut out twice again. I have just replaced this relay now and checked the throttle body and replaced the breather hoses, Any other suggestions would be gratefully received as i think the next step is to burn it out!!!!!!!!! Many thanx in advance.
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You aint stated that if you have replaced the relay number 30 in top row of the fuse box,
If you have not and its a black one i suggest you try that, the new one is a upgraded part and it controls the ECU, for the engine the relay you will replace it with will be grey and of german made quality, the black relay is malaysian crap, ive replaced mine and it appears all fine now, as it did within 10 miles from cold everytime.
Worth a try under a £10 as well.
Mine was doing exactly the same as yours 60- 70 mph or any speed, and it was though you had turned the key off and you would be out on a limb, it would always restart sometimes straight away others i would have to wait upto 10 mins etc.
hope this helps cheers Rob
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Hi Rob cheers for the advice mate i have just replaced relay No 30 with the grey one from VW like you have suggested, driving down to portsmouth tomorrow so will see how it runs then and let you know. Many thanks Pete.
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HI I'M NEW TO HERE BUT THOUGHT I WOULD PUT MY PROBLEM IN SO FAR
1.STALLING WHEN COLD,HAD THE CAR (95 8V)FOR 2 YEARS AND CLEANED THE THROTTLE BODY ALWAYS CURED THIS.
2.5TH GEAR ABOUT 50 MPH,OIL LIGHT FLASHED ENGINE REVS DROPPED TO ZERO THEN PICKED AWAY WITHOUT COMING TO ANYTHING,JUST CLEAN THROTTLE BODY ME THINKS
3.DONE THAT AND ALL OK,NOT ENGINE REVING TO 1400 ON TICKOVER WHEN WARM,I'LL GET IT LATER I THOUGHT.
4HEAVENS HAVE OPENED,NO JACKET JUST MY KEBAB IN HAND AND IT'S DARK OCLOCK IN A DISABLED SPACE ,I JUMPED IN STARTED AS NORMAL THEN CUT OUT HAD A QUICK LOOK AND SEEN NOTHING WAITED 5 MINS THEN SAME AGAIN,THEN HAD TO CALL UPON MY YOUNGER BROTHER IN THE 3 CYLINDER PIMPED CORSA FOR A LIFT:cry:
5.GOT A TOW HOME THE BATTERY WAS FLAT BY NOW,GOT ANOTHER AND TRIED TO START AND I HAVE NO SPARK,IGNITION ON AND TESTING THE DIZZY PLUG I HAVE 10 V AT ONE WIRE AND 11V AT AN OTHER AND I THINK THE THIRD IS AN EARTH,I HAVE ORDERED A COIL AND A NO30 RELAY AND IT'S STILL RAINING,I WILL FIT PARTS TODAY AND KEEP POSTING !
CHEERS BILL !
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NEW NO.30 RELAY AND COIL ,STILL NO SPARK !
ANY SUGGESTIONS WELCOME.
BILL !
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Just a little thought everyone is on about there cars cutting out and I've read alot bout crank sensors and relays but nobody has mentioned the lambour sensor on the exhaust this daft as it sounds does have alot to do with the running of the motor and being fixed in the exhaust does get extreamly hot and sutted up try giving that a clean with a wire brush but be gentle coz if you break it your looking at £80-100 quid for a new one hey It's worth a try!! :cool:
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Good point for ruff running, but if you disconnect the lamda it will still run wont it ? albeit crap.
OX1l, i would go for crank position sensor £64 from ECP if i remember.
I think this cutting out issue whole thing is split in to two sections.
1, being cutting out from idle or peatering away till cuts out, combined with intermittant idle speeds.
A, usually idle control valve, air leaks, mixture problems etc.
2, being the total loss of engine spark at any speed ie 60mph, like turning the key off,
A, usually relay 30 breaking down, crank position sensor breakdown, hall effect sensor,
my opinion anyways.
The trouble is, most people have spent a fortune on, plugs, rotor arms, dizzy caps, plug leads, etc, and then a diagnostic fee here and there and a bit of labour, causing bills before you start.
:cry:
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Hi everyone thanx for all the advice on the cutting out problem. I have just replaced the speed sensor (crank) the one that the original garage told me i never had fitted on my car (tossers) and so far so good. Tried all the other fixes that were posted as well but hope this is the end of it now. After spending so much money on the obvious things i think it would have been cheaper to just go to VW main dealer in the first place.
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STILL NO JOY ,I TRIED ANOTHER DIZZY,GETTING POWER TO COIL AND DIZZY.
THEN IT STARTED ! FIRST TIME IN A WEEK,TRAVELLED 6 MLS THE NEXT DAY SLIGHT MISS THEN CUT OUT THEN RUN,PARKED THE CAR FOR 1 HOUR THEN IT WOULDN'T START,BACK 4 HRS LATER AND IT WENT FRO A MILE,TOWED IT TO TARDUFF MOTORS 20 MLS AWAY(VERY GOOD REPUTATION) PHONED ALL TESTS NEGATIVE SUSPECT ECU OR WIRING FAULT............I'M BUYING A FOCUS TIL I GET IT SORTED :sick: :cry:
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Hi,
Got a R reg 98 Mark 3 GTI 8V.
The problem your on about has happened to me the past 2 mornings when I have gone to start the car.
Turn the key, car turns over but wont start and oil light flashes.
When I get it started the revs die when I put the accelerator down.
Eventually I can get it running and then its OK.
Having it looked at tomorrow. Sounds the same problem as your having.
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Hi scott ime Harry and i Have a mk 3 GTi golf 8 valve and while my dad was driving down the motaway and
The oil light flashed and a very loaud alarm went off so he pulled over and had a look but it was to bad to
touch so he called the AA but they coudnt fix it but he said it was the oil pumb was broken or clogged
so he drove him home and at the weekend we took the oil pump out and clened it out because there
Was metal in it so we clened it out With petrol and it started a treat But here i am Kicking my self :cry:
It wont Start at all it fire`s but then cuts out its been like this for about a week :angry: :cry: :sad:
Could any one help me PLEASE PLEASE! ime killing my self
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well its still an active forum i started! :laugh:
BombadierX the oil light flashing sydrome i was having was just that, the oil light flashing, no buzzer sounding, and also the engine cut out!
I also have come across so many people with this problem that seems to affect '96 - '97 - '98 year motors as vw were sourceing their relays from south america i believe! and it also annoys me that they (meaning vw) must know about this problem but are charging owners lots of money looking at everything else first before changing a £11 relay :angry:
I also think vw should have this as a recall for crap faulty parts!
well thats my two penniths worth!
have fun
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Yea it still wont Start and its not relay so i dunno :cry: so its making me :sick:
cus i need it but whatever TRevet :grin:
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Have you tried vag-com to see if it has listed any fault codes? it wouldnt be the oil pump that stops it from working, (unless it seizes!) so it sounds like an electrical or fuel problem, so a good place to start is to get any fault codes looked at.
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if i remember rightly its the 109 relay try changing this 90% certain will cure your problem also if the cars not running and the fault memory is checked it will bring up a fault with the speed sensor until the car is running then the fault goes also worth changing your ign switch as these play up for a past time
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Hey Its me again Fixed car now :smiley: :smiley: :smiley: :smiley: guess what was wrong put spair key in
and it worked and then put main key in it fired then cut out so the key was warn how weard ime getting
a new one but how weard lol :smug: ime so HAPPY. :laugh: :grin: :smiley: :smiley: :cool:
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Hi, wondered if anyone can help me cos i'm banging my head against a brickwall! >:(
I have a 1997 P reg gti 2.0l 8v and the problem i'm having is that the car keeps cutting out on me, it doesnt matter if i'm travelling at speed or not (infact its just happened while I was on the dartford crossing bridge at 5pm! very scarey) When it cuts out the oil light flashes and the rev counter goes straight to zero, now somtimes it will start straight away and somtimes it takes ages to start, when it doesnt start, the engine turns over as normal but the oil light flashes.
Now the first thing I checked was the Oil (duh!) But the oil is ok, when i take the oil filler cap of, there is presure there so I think the oil pump is ok, and I dont think its an oil problem cos if there was a problem surley it would do it all the time, somtimes its weeks before it would cut out and somtimes it does it several times a day! I once went to a party when I met a guy who is a salesman for vw, and he reckons its the hall effect sensor, now I dont know wether this is true, after all he just sells the dam things!
Please can anyone help me?
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earl, it's the crank angle sensor.
the hall sensor is the thing on the distributor and if it was that it would start over pretty much straight away or not at all.
Rich
for the record, the crank angle sensor will cut out around when the oil reaches 70 because of the viscosity of it at higher temperatures.
Rich
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:wink: Hey earl ime Harry
Have you tried a differant key or the barrel or like rich said the crank angle sensor or the fuel pump relay
I think its the problem we had it wasant cutting out but when my dad was going down the motorway
the car cut out completely so he pulled into the hard shoulder (Very Scary) :shocked: and he restarted th engine
and it started but sounded like a diesel engine Hello its petrol so dad had 2 ring the AA they said the car was very :sick: (SICK)
so he towed my dad home anyway we took it in the garage and took The sump Off and the OIL pump and cleaned it
with petrol but it was a bit of a nightmere because there where like 20 bolts holding the sump ON :sad: but when we had Finnished
:laugh: YIPEE it worked a treat so there you go not very complicated.
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I'll say this once only. The AGG engine is a piece of sh!t. The 2E is suprisingly a lot better.
I'm selling my golf.
Rich
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HI STILL NO GOLF,
OXB1L HAS HAD A DIZZY,HALL SENSOR, KNOCK SENSOR,COIL AND AN ECU FITTED WHILE AT VW (JUST ASWELL I KNOW A MAN WHO KNOWS A MAN EH !)SOMETIMES IT SPARKS SOME IT WONT,MEANWHILE I HAVE BOUGHT A CIVIC VTI V REG NICE CAR BUT IT'S NOT MY GOLF :cry:
I WILL KEEP POSTIN ,PS DONT BUY A VTI THEY'RE SHOCKING ON FUEL COMPARED TO A GOLF !
L8R BILL !
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Hi
Think I've got the same problem. Going along fine and the revs suddenly drop and the engine cuts out. Happened twice so far. There's no warning. Happens when accelerating, build up the revs but then they just drop and the whole car cuts out! Happened last night in the dark after going round a 90 degree bend... it just died. Arghhhhhh! I was waiting for someone to come round the bend and straight into the back of me! Also.......in the mornings sometimes when I start it it turns over like the battery is flat. Ignition off. Back on again and its fine. Wonder if that would be part of the relay problem everyone else is talking about.
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Hi,
I had similar problems with my GTI.
mine turned out to be the engine speed sender, which sits down by the oil filter housing in the cylinder block. Very common fault on these engines and normally plays up when hot. normal fault is for the outer wire shield cracks due to heat and time, which then either short circuits or allows moisture e.t.c to work its way into the sender causing a signal problem.
The other item I changed just because it had started to crack was the coil, this is also a known problem to VW group.
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HI,
I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM WHITH MY GOLF GTI 8V P REG.I HAVE NOT HAD IT LONG,SHORTLY BUYING IT THIS PROBLEM STARTED.I CAN BE DRIVING AT ANY SPEED WHEN THE REVS GO TO ZERO AND MY OIL LIGHT FLASHES ON.IT MAY START STRAIGHT AWAY BUT USUALLY HAVE TO WAIT A WHILE UNTIL MY OIL LIGHT STOPS FLASHING,THIS IS GETTING ANOYING I HAVE CHANGED MY ECU RELAY BUT STILL THE SAME ANY SUGGESTIONS PLEASE
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Hiya
My 96 AGG 8v (simos 4s) GTI has been doing the random on and off cutout for about a year now :sad:
The best stretch with no bs was 8 months. Car was imported ex UK to New Zealand in 2001 and has 62miles on the clock.
Have done all new vag parts - dizzy cap/rotor, ht leads, coil, plugs, new battery, fuel/air filter, tb is ok, maf is ok, hall sender is ok, all the air/water/oil piping is brand new too, and vagcom brings up no faults.
I did remove the factory rubbish exhaust in 2005 (cat not needed in NZ for wof/mot) And i will replace that black #30 relay with the grey one this week.
I did try the black #30 relay from the 97 16v, but the cutout is still the same, its total death, no runon or shudder the revs just die!!!
Wait 2 minutes and then she fires up, no problem :rolleyes: not good if you are stuck in traffic huh.
A mate of mine imports lots of mk3 golfs to NZ from Japan and this is the main cause of silly annoying faults with them on this side of the world too.
The later Variant and the Vento 97-98 also gets the AGG 8v and my mate says that the cause of the cutout issue for this engine (in most cases for him) is the CRANK ANGLE POSITION SENSOR located just below and behind the oil filter crapping out, as well as that factory black #30 relay.
The engine itself is in good nick and runs real good when it runs :smiley:
Can anyone please advise how to remove this? Do i have to remove the front engine mount?
Or is it a simple 'click and twist out' jobbie?
I just want to fix this once and for all and maybe help others do the same.
Thanx muchly
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1996 8v GTi (AGG engine)
Here's my update to the cutting out problem on my '96 Gti 8V. Took it to VAG dealer (£75 labour an hour! How much?!!) who replaced a split hose which ran into the throttle body, and the dizzy cap. Ran diagnostics again and they found a second fault, the throttle body was idling at 1300 revs and they couldn't reset it. So they said only solution is a new one. Car ran fine for about 3 days and its come back again. So back to square one.
Read this forum thru again and bought a new ECU power supply relay and fitted that but its still cutting out.
So took it back to VW dealer in Worthing. They had it all day and had no idea why its cutting out. They came up with the same suggestions as this forum! Speaks well for this forum, but not very well for dealers.
So, I've given up on VW dealers. Next I'm goign to try the fuel pump relay. If that doesn't work I'll do the engine speed sensor. (quoted £120 from VW for the part and £170 in labour and VAT. ECP want £39 for the part. Think I know where I'll go!)
P.S.... Dealer said if I can start the car straight away after it cuts out then its not the Hall Sender unit. If it was, I would need to wait about 15 mins before starting it again. So.... its not that then (apparently!)
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here's a pic showing location of sensor's on an ady engine with simos 4s injection(but agg akr similar)
(http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k165/boneybradley/DSCN3430-1.jpg)
Hopefully this will help people locate thing's when the problem's start but the common fault's seem to be
1 dirty throttle body
2 faulty ecu relay no 30
3 faulty fuel pump relay no167
4 hall sender
5 Crank angle sensor/engine speed sensor
6 ecu temp sensor
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I Just wanna say there is Life During a Problem,albeit prolonged,of this Nature... :smiley: I've been suffering with it for three months now, and for two of it, the Car won't even Start.. I work a lot, so Havent had a Great deal of time... Have changed, Fuel-pump-relay,Dizzy,cap,rotor-arm,HT-Leads,cleaned throttle-body,Coil is Good.. Got Good-compression,Fuel is Pumping,got good-spark.. Turns over and over... Still no-joy.. Have spent over Six hours reading-up on this Issue on here... :embarassed: :shocked: So, plan on changing no.30 relay(ECU-£11).. Ignition switch (cheap£5?)... Check the Earth-wire under Fusebox... Thanks to everybody who took time to contribute :smiley: Always open to any Suggestions... After the above, I will probably Pay VW the £30 they want to set base ignition timing,and clear any faults, thanks, Paul...
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Hi Kestrel,
Some one may or may not have mentioned this, but it went wrong on my GTI and have changed loads on cars where I work.... the part was the crankshaft speed sender. it sits down under the front engine mount in the cylinder block, and the loom down to it normally cracks open due to the heat e.t.c. Worth a look.
Hope you get it sorted soon.
Jochen.
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I thinks this is the main cause of my trouble...
How do i remove the 'crank angle position sensor' ?? its the same thing as the 'crank shaft speed sender' mentioned above.
Its stuck under and behind the front engine mount/oil filter
c**t of a place :sad:
fanx
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bsting,
It is the same sensor.
You need to support engine, and remove front engine mount bracket. then you can just about get on the bolt ( 5mm allen key type ) and pull sender out.
Make sure the old oil seal comes out with sender and that you buy a good quality sender, or it will leak oil everywhere ( no from experience ).
Jochen.
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Cheers matey :smiley:
Will do just that and replace it with a new sensor. I will change the lead going to it at the same time.
Easy to get that lead from wrecked Ventos (agg 8v) in nz.
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:smiley:To everyone with this problem, :smiley:
Found a solution! The Engine Speed Sensor did it. Also knowns as Crank Angle Sensor. Forget VW garages - they're clueless. They'd never even heard of the problem. So I pronted out these pages and shoved it under their nose!
I've used this forum to work out possible solutions and I've gone thru them one at a time. First I changed the ECU relay, and then the fuel pump relay. Both made no difference.
So the next was the engine speed sensor which appears to have done it. Cost £39.99 from ECP (VW want £120!) and got my local garage to fit it. He said it was awkward to get it out. You can't see it from a ramp. You need to take the starter motor out etc etc. Anyhow, when he took it out the wires were badly mangled and you could see the cores of the wires! -The outer sleeves had been stripped away so its likely it was shorting and causing the car to just die. So my advice is........................ change this part first.
Good luck. Mat
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mat i had the same problem but my oil light would flash and cut out tried no30relay and also no167 relay made no difference,took it a mates he had the car for a week for him to drive and see for himself what the problem was, and he changed the crank sensor and its like a new car,done 110miles in it not missed a beat. forget vw garages they have not got a clue,just like to take your money , john.
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Jeeeese....this thread goes on 'n on 'n on, dunnit!
Here's my latest....for my just-ordered for my Mk3 gti 8v ('98 R plate......22,000 ORIGINAL miles on clock....she's a bute!)....'167' & '30' relays. VW stealers had 167 in stock, ordered '30' for collection 4 days later. Went today to pick it up......they'd ordered in another '167' !!!!!! "Sorry and worry not, mate", they said, "we'll get you one straight away, they're common, just hang on we'll phone around locally". They did. Not one to be had anywhere in a 20 mile radius!! So, question, where CAN you get the '30' relay (165 906 381)? I've tried searches online, etc, can't seem to find anyone offering it. Ken
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Hi Guys, that last post of mine should read, at the start, '........just-ordered for my just-got Mk3 gti........'
Ken.
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i got mine from my local vw dealer
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hi guys been suffering from this cut out thing for ages now, happened jst couple of days ago with couple of my housemates in the car... i've changed relays, dizzy cap, plugs, leads, ignition switch... then after readin the latest solutions i thought lets try one more thing before i get rid of it... the crankshaft sensor... thought i'd ring up the stealership for a laugh BUT they said that for my engine 2E that sensor doesn't exist!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I did notice that someone wrote if the car doesn't start straight away after cuttin out it could be the hall sender... problem is mine sometimes starts straight away but sometimes takes >15 mins :cry: hate to say it but time to get a new car maybe type R.... any help peeps????
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:smiley: Hi Jochen,and thanks for the Advice.. but my engine is a 2E, and someone on here has said they dont have the E.S.S.crankshaft sender.. Although I have replaced a small magnetic "knock" sensor,that sits in the lower part of the Block,same height as dizzy,in the centre lookin' at you... I put one on off a Jetta.. went down yesterday,fitted my newly-arrived ECU relay, managed to get it going,but far from great.. Have done the TDC/lining-up on Dizzy,got good spark,fuel.. Its just the timing... Gonna have to take it to VW,unless you got any other suggestions ?..
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HI STILL NOT GOT MY GOLF BACK BUT I DID GET THE FUSE BOX CHANGED AS THE TECHNICIAN WORKING ON IT DISCOVERED IT WAS MAKING NOISES AND IT SHOULDN'T
IT NOW RUNS FOR 5 MINS BEFORE STOP THEN LEAVE IT A WHILE AND IT GOES FOR ANOTHER 5
PS THE VTI I GOT FOR A RUNAROUND IS NOT THAT BAD ON FUEL NOW I'VE STOPPED REVING IT TO 8K IN EACH GEAR ANY SUGGESTIONS FOR THE GOLF ????
CHEERS BILL!
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Exactly same problem with my P reg!!
I changed everything (HT leads, rotary arm, spark plugs, fuel filter, ignition switch, regulator and so on, even cleaned the injectors) and it still did it.
Eventually I found a old boy who'd worked for VW for the last 200 years and he said "it's more than likely the 'crank sensor'"
It's a bugger to get to so I had to take it to a local garage - part £50 (German & Swedish) + 1 hrs labour and gues what - that was it! Fixed!!
No more intermitent cutting out!!
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Hi all,
I would like to point out that if any of the suggested items are faulty - then the car will fail.
Think about it -
1. ECU relay fails, no power to the computer hence the car dies.
2. Fuel pump relay fails, no fuel is pumped hence the car dies.
3. Hall or Crank sensor fails, then the computer doesnt know where TDC is etc, so the timing goes out, hence the car dies.
4. Oil pressure sender fails, computer cuts the fuel / spark to protect the engine, hence the car dies.
The bottom line is that ALL these things need to work or the car will cut out!
I must admit im staggered that so many people have had similar faults from the same car, although we are all driving 10+ year old motors and things can and will go wrong. Having read every post on this board regards this problem, the only route to follow is substitution of potential electrical sensors / relays one by one unless VAG points to one particular item.
AGAIN - any ONE of these things failing will cut the engine. Theres no magic cure, just logical fault finding one step at a time.
If you have the electronic equipment to check a part then you can verify whether it works or not. If you dont then substitution one by one is the ONLY alternative :cool:
One last point - mention by BoneyBradley in other posts and not said here yet, is the timing belt. It times the camshaft to the crank, and it can be fitted 1 or more teeth out, or can jump if the tensioner is failing. My car had the belt changed and it suffers from the cutting-out-while idling / hard to start thing. If you can check it or get it checked, do that too. My car "hunts" up and down on idle, and I think he is spot on with that suggestion for me - but your fault may be different.
** What he said about it got me thinking, and it turns out that many years ago we had an audi 80 sport as the family car, it died one day, wouldnt start, and in desperation my old man checked the timing belt setting, and it had jumped 2 teeth out, after running fine previously. He apparently just took it off and refitted it, tightening the tensioner, and it worked after 2 weeks of no starting! (the belt was the last thing he tried) **
If you have these problems, check ALL of the above stuff - not just one thing. :wink:
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Hi All
I have had the cutting out problem for ages now, but I am not driving the car much due to this irritating problem. My symptoms and fix attempts are as follows:-
1] Cutting out when slowing at junctions, and it seems to happen when the clutch is dipped. If I get it out of gear quick and lift up he clutch pedal, it can sometimes stop the car from dying, though you can feel it begin to die and the oil light attempt to come on..
2] The car starts straight away after it has died.
3] Once it got to a stage where it wouldn't start on the drive, then I got a new relay 30 after reading this thread, and hey presto it came to life. It then did about 250 miles without cutting out before it started again. Like before, it seems to be when slowing down, at junctions and when the clutch is dipped.
Now I am not sure what to do next. The dipping clutch/slowing down may be a clue to someone who knows about these things - but not me. Does it point to the crank sensor? If so is it easy to fit/find?
Any further advice will be welcomed.
Good luck to all.
JULEE
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julee, your fault sounds like the ISV or idle stabilisation valve - if fitted (not all engines have one), or an air leak from the vacuum hoses...
If you have one, its a long cylinder shaped jobby fitted in front of the throttle body, under the throttle cable connection.
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Thanks EvilScotsman,
I've took a look at my engine around the throttle body area and there is a small rubber braided pipe approx 18cm long coming from a bronze long tubular part. Is this the ISV? The pipe is connected to an outlet on the throttle body. This pipe is in a poor condition and is perrished somewhat at the throttle body end of it. Is this a vacumm hose that you speak of?
I plan on changing this tomorrow to see it's effect.
I'll let you know how I get on.
Can't post piccies yet, but will soon when I upload them somewhere.
Julee
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OK here's the perished pipe that I am talking about. Would the condition of this pipe make the car cut-out?
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s278/julee200/golf/pipe.jpg)
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If it's the pipe with the green bung's and valve on....yes it can make the car cut out....I had the same pipe go on my last golf and it didn't idle until I gaffered it up.
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Julee thats the vacuum pipe to the fuel pressure regulator on the end of the fuel rail. It would leak air when rotten (mine was) but wasnt enough to cut the engine as too small bore.
I fixed mine but - that wasnt the fault
HOWEVER my car started doing what yours is today and it was the throttle cable had become tight and stretched so was slightly too long allowing the butterfly valve in the throttle close too much, so it cut out each time i dipped the clutch. I adjusted the cable stop clip and it runs ok now tho still needs a new cable. Pull off the wee steel clip on the throttle cable sheath and wiggle the sheath out a bit then put the clip one or two rungs closer to the end, then try it. You might need a wee bit of throttle pedal while starting it, but it shouldnt cut out.
Try it and let us know :cool:
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Got a Mk3 1.6 GL. Same symptoms, cutting out randomly with Oil light on, starts again after 2 mins.
Changed Relay 30, had a black Made in Tunisia, now got a grey Made in Germany. 200 miles+ city / motorway / A road with no cutting out. Will advise if does cut out again.
Thanks all for the help and advice. An hour reading on here and £11 part and (hopefully) problem solved, no thanks VW Altrincham.
Cheers
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I am going to try and adjust the throttle cable and see what happens.
Will let you know the outcome.
I did change the black striped pipe but :smiley: nothing good happened - as you say the bore is only small.
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Hi everyone, i have been experiencing the cutting out with oil lights for around 6 weeks now, also the car wants to stall at lights etc.... after reading this forum (lots!) and 3 weeks at mates garage it looks like the ignition relay has done the trick with the random cut outs at least :laugh:
This worked for me, it looks like different things work for different people as i tried relay 30, crank sensor etc etc.... Just takes a while to find it!
As for the stalling when dipping the clutch? have looked at another thread under the mk3 section starting with "trouble shooting mk3 gti 8v engine......" - very usefull! this weekend will clean out throttle bodies and fit new air mass sensor as mentioned there - so should cure the traffic light dance with the throttle and clutch!
Must say this is the first vw I've owned and the support network/forums are fantastic! would have sold up by now otherwise, thanks :cool:
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The sysmptoms of my GTi were :-
Stalling when slowing, mainly at junctions. Seemed to happen when clutch was dipped at junctions/lights, though the stalling could be got round by dancing a little on the clutch/accelerator. The rev counter showed erratic idling at 800, dipping to 750.
Just bought some carb cleaner for a fiver. Took the hard pipe off on the side of the throttle box to check the condition of the butterfly and it was caked especially around the edges, where I believe the clearance is rather important.
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s278/julee200/golf/tbvdirty.jpg)
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s278/julee200/golf/tbdirty.jpg)
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s278/julee200/golf/tbclean.jpg)
This pic shows the edge of the butterfly after I scraped off a little gunk.
So, I cleaned it out with the carb cleaner. Sorry didn't take any piccs after clean.
After re-assembly, I took it for a test drive. I niticed that the idle was a lot more sharper at around 925 and it was stable. Took it for a drive, purposely finding as many lights and juctions as I could, and guess what. It did not stall. It has only been on a 15 minute drive but this used to be enough for it to stall umpteen times. I will let you know how it goes.
As I was cleaning it, I found the hose connected to the hard piping full of gunk. Can anyone tell me what the red circled box is in the following picture, and what the red arrowed hose does - this was full of gunk!!
I would like to perform a more thorough clean when I know what I am doing.
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s278/julee200/golf/engineq.jpg)
Hope some of this helps anyone out there with similar problems.
JULEE :smiley:
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Julee - thats the engine breather box - under that cover (its hard to pop off but does just pull off from the back when the screws are out) - thats where the crap in the TB comes from.
My TB was dirty too and you are right, the gap is tiny and critical to the idle speed. I took the TB off and gave it a right good seeing to(lol) and now it idles perfectly all the time. I was able to have it idling wi the throttle cable disconnected so that was a red herring. I still have a kind of soft misfire between 2k and 3k as a lot of folks have mentioned too, so im thinking the MAF needs cleaned, or the fuel pressure regulator is fooked - haven't got round to those bits yet. Doesnt do the misfire thing when its started in the morning, just when its warmed up. May be the ECU temp sensor too i guess :cool:
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Quick update:
I planned to clean out throttle bodies this weekend - but was put off with the thought of taking so much apart. Was advised to simply take off the air filter box and squirt carb cleaner into the air intake (needed the misses to accelerate as it makes the engine want to stop)...
It worked! have covered nearly 100 miles since and hasn't faulted! :grin:
Hopefully my ordeal is over???!!!! In the past few months have had:
Wing mirror stolen :angry:
Bumped into in a car park by a little boy in a bazzed up corsa :angry: :angry:
Engine died randomly - 3 weeks in garage :sick:
Engine stalls :sick:
Exhaust replaced :sad:
Wheel bearing replaced :sad:
So I'm hoping to have a break from problems.... please!!!!!!
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:smiley: :smiley:
MY CAR RUNS !!!
I have replaced the 30 relay,cleaned the throttle body,replaced the perished hoses,had a new fuse box fitted as we were loosing earths(this was noticed due to noises coming from the box) and finally the engine speed sensor cured it !!
BUT the computer was getting all the correct signals from the sensor and would run sometimes but not others this was due to perished coating on the wires hence touching bare wires =NO GO
but when they weren't touching it would go ok.
these wires are not visibly damaged only after removing the sleeving was this found.
hope this may help someone else
drove Edinburgh to Glasgow no probs sailed its mot :smiley:
Honda civic VTI for sale !!!
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Hi i have been suffering from the same problem.....
I have already changed the the ecu relay and the ignition coil but with no joy.
Is there a difference between the 'ecu relay' and the 'hall sensor'?
cheers guys.......... :huh:
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Hall sendor/sensor is on the side of the dizzy..and the ecu relay is in the fuse box. both cause crappy idle problem's and another thing ragy there is also a fuel pump relay that's unreliable and would be worth swapping
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The part # for the 'crank angle sensor' is...
037 906 433
You can buy non-vag, the brand is called 'FACET' (made in italy)
Its the same part with the same # on the box and a bit cheaper too.
The 8v AGG and the 16v ABF use the same sensor, not sure on others
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Hi there
How is everyone getting on? bloody golfs :grin:
Hey, for me i did this....changed the crank angle sensor, and fitted a new #30 relay.
The car fired up sweet and idled as good as. Let her warm up and took her for a wee fang....touch wood....all is well.
I will clean up the throttle body as well and run a bit of AV-GAS in her to really clean things up!!!!
The #30 relay part # is 165 906 381 - WLO 50 237 007
Make sure you get a light grey/brown coloured one with 'made in germany' on it and it comes brand new in a vag box.
Do not bother with the Tunisian (my old one) or Malaysian made crap if they are still on the market.
Hope that helps, and everyone is ok :smiley:
The fuel relay is #167 you will see it there too, i might do mine as well.
But will see how i go with what i have done so far...
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I've done a few posts here about my 96 8v and here's an update!
I have replaced these so far:
1. ECU relay (30)
2. Fuel pump relay (167)
3. Another of the obvious relays (58???)
4. New throttle body and vacuum hose
5. Engine speed sensor/crank angle sensor (its the same thing)
6. Fuel pump which includes lift pump/swirl pot (vw mechanic with 30 yrs experience said this could be it)
7. Dizzy cap
8. New cambelt (not really relevant but it was due for it but timing is fine so its not the belt/tooth problem)
And... ITS STILL DOING IT!!! Bas***d thing.
Remeber the advertising slogan in the 80's/90's. It went "If only everything in life was as reliable as a Volkswagen" Thank God its not!!! We would have topped ourselves!!!!
VW stealership can find nothing. And I'm running out of ideas. Anybody got any? I'm thinking its coming back to something electrical. I read on here about the oil pressure regulator can fail and tell the car to switch off.
Cheers
Mat
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I'm not sure I should say this... and I know it's going to tempt fate, but I think the ECU relay has solved my problem, though it's only been a week or so... it's looking promising...
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Its a slim possibility but something no-one has looked at so far for cars that dont respond to the usual fixes - is the immobiliser. The VW one built into the ecu.
I wonder if someone who's car does this got it scanned right away by vag com or something would have gotten an "engine start blocked" code from the ecu? Just thinking outside the box lol, I read a post on a US site from a guy who instrument cluster (later VR6's etc) has the transponder in it and was intermittently causing an open circuit and triggering the immo. Another had a low signal from the chip in the key (all gti / vr6) and the car wouldnt start.
I x-rayed my key at work an it has a small chip the size of an anadin capsule at one edge of the plastic bit. Its read by an inductive wire loop round the ignition barrel. If that wire is moved off the barrel or breakes or unwinds it wont work or will be intermittent too.
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I had this problem :angry:
Changed the Relay for a later white one....
still had cutting out problems. Changed the crank sensor (or pulse sensor). The wires were broken! :evil:
VW charged me £113 for a new one on trade! still flippin expensive :shocked:
You have to take off the engine mount bracket which longs your life out abit :angry:
Old against the new pulse sensor..
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v104/sat1s1ngh/sensordamage.jpg)
EDIT: went out for a long drive and it has not cut out yet (thank God)
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Nice one. My 8v AGG is running as sweet as it will ever get, no issues for weeks now :smiley:
The idle is perfect.
A 16v ABF is going into her at the moment (I planned to do this months ago) and got a complete doner car in 06.
The 8v is going in the doner (a 5dr GTI)
For those that are still having cutout issues (and have replaced all of the above) if you have a second key (later OBD2 chipped ones) try that for a while. It may be an immobilizer problem....
Hope it helps
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I'm not sure I should say this... and I know it's going to tempt fate, but I think the ECU relay has solved my problem, though it's only been a week or so... it's looking promising...
Still going well... crosses fingers... ECU relay... yey!
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How much of an arse is the crank sensor to get out? is it like those ABS sensors and shear the head of the bolt, then snap half the sensor off in the engine, or do they come out fairly easy?
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I've been reading this thread with great interest.
My Golf GTi 8v ADY engine has been doing the same thing and am now unable to drive without it breaking down. Could some one tell me is the crank sensor also known as the Knock Sensor. Because I can't find anything about the crank sensor the Haynes manual.
The cars currently at my local garage, they've changed most things but at no cost as they have a supplier who credits them if the items don't cure the fault - nice.
The list of items that have been changed/tested by myself or the garage
1. Fuel Pump Relay
2. ECU Relay
3. HT leads
4. Spark Plugs
5. Earthing Points
6. Ignition Coil
7. Hall Sensor
8. ECU has been tested nothing nasty found
Might take the spare key up there see how they get on with that.
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hi mate
the crank sensor is also known as the pulse sensor. Yours is deffo nackerd and is causing this problem
try EURO PARTS for this as they are way cheaper than VW
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How much of an arse is the crank sensor to get out? is it like those ABS sensors and shear the head of the bolt, then snap half the sensor off in the engine, or do they come out fairly easy?
you need to remove the front engine mount bracket so need at least 2 jacks. one to lift the car and the other to support the engine while the bracket is out. The sensor is behind this bracket and is held in by an allen key which is likely to round.
the engine mount bracket has the flippin starter motor attached (yay :rolleyes: ) The bolts go through the starter motor and into the bracket.
hope that helps. im crap at explaining
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FIXED IT!!!! :smiley: :grin: :laugh: :smug: :grin:
I have replaced these so far: (standard Gti 8V)
1. ECU relay (30)
2. Fuel pump relay (167)
3. Another of the obvious relays (58???)
4. New throttle body and vacuum hose
5. Engine speed sensor/crank angle sensor (its the same thing)
6. Fuel pump which includes lift pump/swirl pot (vw mechanic with 30 yrs experience said this could be it)
7. Dizzy cap
8. New cambelt (not really relevant but it was due for it but timing is fine so its not the belt/tooth problem)
...but none of it worked so I tried running it on Super Unleaded and its PERFECT!!!!!!!!!!!! I hope someone's not gonna tell me it should be run on Super - I could have saved over a £1000 on all the the above. But its had 4 tanks now and t hasn;t cut out once. Makes no sense at all but its fixed so I don't really care!
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Hi there
I'd just like to add my name to those with the same effing problem - engine cuts out and oil light comes on - this is with a 97 p reg GTI.
I've taken it to three garages and they haven't had a clue. This thread has given me a few ideas to try out. Dunno how I missed this site.
Last Tuesday, fast lane of the M1 with lorries weaving about in the wind and rain and it cut out, got it started again but it was a bit like a bucking bronco. Done my nerves in completely. It's been this way for a while and I've just about given up.
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Well I took most peoples advice and replaced the crank sensor, I'd already done the relays and all the other obvious things.
It had been at the garage for well over a month, they're auto-electrician was dead against it but agreed if I bought the part (cheaper off ebay). They fitted the part then said that there was a dodgy connection in the wiring loom??? :undecided:.
Well I got it back looked under the bonnet yes they had fitted the crank sensor, but there was a boot connector hanging off a shiny new crimp connection on the RHD side of the engine just below the camshaft it looked like some sort of sensor can't find any reference of it anywhere and it has only got one wire going to it...........anybody out there know what this is?????
The only thing it still does occassionally which it had done long before the cutting out problem is hesitates on acceleration in 2nd - 3rd gear and most times when engine is cold.
I might have a look at the throttle housing today see how unclean it is or unless anybody out there has any other suggestions?
Cheers
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FIXED IT!!!! :smiley: :grin: :laugh: :smug: :grin:
I have replaced these so far: (standard Gti 8V)
1. ECU relay (30)
2. Fuel pump relay (167)
3. Another of the obvious relays (58???)
4. New throttle body and vacuum hose
5. Engine speed sensor/crank angle sensor (its the same thing)
6. Fuel pump which includes lift pump/swirl pot (vw mechanic with 30 yrs experience said this could be it)
7. Dizzy cap
8. New cambelt (not really relevant but it was due for it but timing is fine so its not the belt/tooth problem)
...but none of it worked so I tried running it on Super Unleaded and its PERFECT!!!!!!!!!!!! I hope someone's not gonna tell me it should be run on Super - I could have saved over a £1000 on all the the above. But its had 4 tanks now and t hasn;t cut out once. Makes no sense at all but its fixed so I don't really care!
must be a faulty "knock sensor" if fuel is fixing it?
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well i bought the ecu 30 relay for about 11 quid from the local vw dealer - on the way to the dealer the car had been cutting out whilst idling and had been a pain the previous weekend BUT since putting the new fuse in I've had no problems at all..so fingers crossed. I'll be waiting for the next thing to go wrong now :wink: the joys of motoring etc etc thanks very much for the advice here.
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Hiya -
You reckon it could be the Knock sensor? Can you tell me a bit more? You might be right!!!
Cheers
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as i understand it the knock sensor detects the octane of the fuel you're using to eliminate pinking
some info here..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engine_knocking
Correct ignition timing is essential for optimum engine performance and fuel efficiency. Modern automotive and small-boat engines have sensors that can detect knock and retard (delay) the ignition (spark plug firing) to prevent it, allowing engines to safely use petrol of below-design octane rating, with the consequence of reduced power and efficiency.
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right.
just got back from a drive to bristol. on the way there gave it some weelie on the m49 car just died, pulled over to the hard shoulder with all the same symptoms (oil light flashing rev counter dropped) leave it 2 mins starts and off we go :smiley:
so stick the mfa on oil temp, reading 92.... boot it til been on 94 for a couple of secs same again.
keep her going wait til temp hits 92 rolling start no problem. :angry:
was picking the cat up from langford house kept a close eye on the temp all the way there stayed at 90-92 drove fine all the rest of the journey.
after getting the cat drove as normal, quite grandadish til i got on the m5 built up to just before the m49, dropped it to 4 and booted hit 94 agian for couple of secs same again, foot of the accelerator watch the temp drop to 92 started fine???
now what made me think to try this was i was stuck in traffic the other day about 15 mins and this happend on pulling off waited 5 mins started fine drove since with clear runs all the time hadn't cut out til today.
i have already fitted a new relay no 30 so i'm pretty sure it's not that, and am being led more to do with temp wise.
any ideas any one.
also my car is mk3 2.0 16v abf 1997 mfa read 33mpg using £20 for 112 miles for the journey? does this sound high?
alcamist
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hullo there - it's me again. I typed too soon! after a week of OK motoring i had the same symptoms that have bugged people on this thread. I've now replaced (30) and (167). I think anything else would be beyond me tho' i will try the other key tomorrow. After that? I could take it to a local garage (for the fourth time) or I could take it to a VW dealer. The thought of the latter makes me weak at the knees. Jeez this car is hacking me off!!!
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hi to all,
my gti 16v cut out on me a week ago, it turned over but didnt fire up and the oil light flashed, and after reading this thread i started with the coil and got hold of a second hand one and bingo my car is running fine :grin:
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dunno if its the same but my bros volvo had the same kind of symptoms just last month, car would drive fine then when booted it would slow as if the battery was flat, but he did notice that the temp gauge was acting funny, after askin a mate at a garage he said check the water temp sensor, apparently it also controls the fuel injection, changed it and it runs fine now, even gets better mpg, try replacing yours, should be near the thermostat, shouldnt cost too much to try?
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ok i just had this happen to me !!! over the past few days and was about to crack up !!
ok changed the following
1) fuel fillter
2) relay 30
3) coil
4) dizzy cap
and more parts........ !!
to cut a long story short a mate found it be a worn/broken fly wheel cable that runs of the cars loom to the fly wheel sensor !!!
so would advice people to check any cables around all of the sensors maybe ?
hope this helps.
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Hi all
Well I felt compelled to put a message on this site as I have spent ages going through all these posts to help diagnose my own Golf-3 GTi cutting-out misery.
Like just about everyone else here, I own a P-reg 8v GTi. About 5 weeks ago it started doing the cutting out thing with oil light flashing, rev counter bouncing around as the engine tried to restart, and clicking noises coming from the relays/fuse box. After a while I started to spot the trend in the symptoms.
It would always happen on re-starting the engine after it's had a run. So it would be fine if starting it cold and run continuously (ie. commute to work and back normally okay) but if I parked for anything up to an hour, then re-started the car, within a few minutes it would cut out usually when accelerating, and would happen 5 or 6 times before settling down. It would always be at low speed (less than 30mph) and thankfully never on the motorway! However a few hairy cases when it would refuse to restart at junctions were pretty stressful. However usually I managed to restart it by turning the ignition while coasting along.
My local VW dealer was useless as they claimed never to have heard of this problem. Thanks to this site, I tried the cheap solutions first - had the throttle body cleaned out around the butterfly (done for free by my local Nationwide AutoCentre on a Saturday afternoon!) and also replaced the ECU relay. These cheap fixes didn't help but what did it for me (it seems - still early days though) was replacement of the CRANK SENSOR.
The garage I took the car to managed to experience the problem on the test drive and also suspected the crank sensor since they do wear out with time and cause the symptoms I was having. They replaced it at a cost of 60pds + VAT and 2 hours' labour.
For anyone having similar symptoms I recommend trying this fix. I couldn't find any other posts on here with the exact same circumstances ie. where it only happened starting the engine hot. The VW part no. (obtained from this site but worth repeating) is #037906433.
Good luck all - and thanks for everyone's contributions to this excellent forum! (still going after all this time!)
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well i dunno where to start. apart from i think my GTI days are over :cry:
just got it back from a vw dealer. it is the speed sensor that needs replacing. unfortunately so does the power steering rack which i only got replaced 3 months ago (i've got a guarantee on that but reckon the garage I got it from will f4ck me about). and the rear shocks are weeping. and the heat shield on the exhaust is loose.and the wires to the outside temp gauge are hanging down.and the brakefluid cap is broken. oh, and one of the number plate lights is out!
the cost for this lot at the dealer is 1600 quid. doubtless i could do it a helluva lot cheaper but this is a 1500 quid car which although is in reasonable condition in looks and only 71K on the clock I don't think i can justify paying out on. availablecar.com awaits....i will have to wait until my late midlife crisis to be able to afford a newer golf!
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well the local garage has tested and tested (apparently) the power steering rack and can't find anything wrong with it - how come the VW garage does???
anyway i'm gonna get the sensor done and take it from there. the part ive been quoted is 037906433a - does the a signify anything?
cheers
j
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My VW dealer quoted me £650 for a hydraulic roof pump (cabrio) + VAT + fitting = roughly £1000....
I mended it myself for £14...
The dealers aren't interested in your car, they are interested only in company car fleets where no one questions the prices.
A mate of mine recently worked for a dealer (not VW) driving cars to and from people's houses before and after services. His instructions were to not take cars back too soon... they were charging for 2.5 hours labour for what took 1 hour... they are thieves plain and simple... moreover though, they are charging you so much that you'll never go back... it works...
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Obviously, you're right about the dealerships. The one visit has put me off for life.
After a quote for 265 quid to replace the crank angle sensor from VW I took it to a local garage that did it for 87 quid. I've had a week now with plenty of trips and mileage and no cutting out etc. So I think you can add my name to the list of people for whom getting the sensor replaced has solved the problem. Hopefully!
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I have got an imported 1993 Golf MK3 GTI 2.0L 16v ABF engine
The problem is some times when i stop the car the revs drop right down and up a few times
untill it stalls. this happens more if i put the AC ON
To fix this i have done all this but without success
new Idle stabilizer valve
throttle body cleaned
All air hoses cleaned
check for air leaks, nothing
done a scan with vag-com no faults.
If there is a fault on relay or sensors would VAG pick it up.
Please help
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My ECU relay was the fault but the VAG think showed up auto gearbox faults and connector faults... randomly so it seemed...
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Hey everyone.
This is my first post.
I've registered as I found this thread after searching Google whilst looking for a diagnosis for my problem.
My R reg ('97) Mk3 Golf GTi 2.0 16v has symptoms as described previously and has cut out on two occasions.
Both times it has been at low revs (i.e. slowing down approaching roundabouts) and a few minutes after starting in the morning. Having pulled over the car turns over but fails to fire up. The first time the AA came out and the second I was close to a garage, but on both occasions the car had been left for a couple of hours and started fine with no problems at all. Each time I have checked the dizzy cap and am definately getting a spark to it. Spark plugs and leads are ok and the fuel is getting through.
I've had the car since February, and prior to buying it the dealer sorted poor running (misfiring) by replacing 'a relay in the ECU'. This was diagnosed after a week of checks. I suspect that this relay was probably the number 30 relay but cannot be sure.
I have read the majority of this thread and most of the problems seem to be reported on the 8v GTi's.
Without reading all 29 pages and being a GTi noob I was hoping that somebody with a knowledge of this model might be able to sympathise with this excruciating problem and give me a definitive checklist of checks / parts to fix the problem?
All help appreciated!
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I don't have a 16v only the 8v :cry:, but after suffering from the same annoying fault might be able to give some quick pointers. It would seem the easiest and cheapest has already been done in the form of changing the ECU Relay with 30 on it. Next up is the fuel pump relay mine had 167 on it but this might be different on the 16v not sure. Think mine was £15+vat from the VW dealer.
Its always worth getting the relays direct from your local VW dealer. Could be worth looking at the throttle body housing a quick squirt with carb cleaner gets rid of any build up of grime put a rag undearneath stops any drips onto manifold, you need to remove the main breather hose from the air filter pair of gas pliers needed (well for mine anyway). From there a no. of sensors and the like I changed the crankshaft sensor and touch wood (frantically touching my head :grin:) its been fine hasn't cut out yet.
I know theres 29 odd pages but it makes a damn good read very interesting. Think the crankshaft sensor from VW is in the region of £125+vat so be warned I got mine off ebay original part in sealed bag but for only £40!
I'm sure other people with 16v's could give you some advice - good luck!
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Both the 8v and 16v have the same #30 ECU and #167 Fuel relays in them.
The crank angle sensor part # is the same in both cars too
:smiley:
If these two relays are stuffed VAGCOM will not pick it up, replace the #30 relay first with a geniune one and take things from there...
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Though the cutting out seems to of been solved on my car, the revs drop while i'm driving then pick up again and normally happens from a cold engine. This never happened before. I think it's more electrical related than fuel.
I can hear one of the relays clicking can't tell which one fortunately i've still got a spare one of each (30 & 167), put them in but is still doing it. I'm taking my own advice and reading back thru all previous posts see if I can pick something up.
Might invest in some new HT leads and maybe an ignition coil if I can track down a cheap one. Cos its intermittent sounds more like an earthing problem?? :undecided: oh yeah checked the throttle body - still nice and clean.
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Check the earth strap to the gearbox and the one going to your relay box (under the dash)
Coils are common to die on mk3s too
New HT leads and a new dizzy cap/rotor never hurts
But there are subtle differences between cars with this cutout problem, an easy fix for one can turn into a major for another :sad: Take the time to have a look back at what others have done from page 1
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The dizzy got changed recently so i'm 99.9% confident its not that. I've found the earth strap in the fuse/relay box, the other one to check is from coil to engine block i'm gonna get some HT leads at lunch so will see.
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firstgolfgti have you swapped the temp sensor and checked all the breathers as these seem to fail and give the current symptoms your stating....
and for everybody..... don't rely on vagcom being correct. mine has had a new air mass sensor as vagcom said it was faulty and in the end it was a split breather hose...
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where is the temp sensor located?
If I found a faulty earth strap, do I get a flat braided one as installed or go for a nice thick black bit of cable with heavy duty crimps?
On the breather hoses I've had them all off check for blockages and splits they seem fine.
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Found the temp sensor.
Two questions:
1. Can I just take the temp sensor out or do I have to drain anything first.
2. Do VR6's and all Corrado's suffer from the cutting out stalling?
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Hi people,
My wife has got a cutting out problem with her 96/P 8v GTI. It usually occurs when the car is cold. It can happen if you blip the throttle and the revs drop and die, it happens when approaching junctions, even happens when you are accelerating (however when accelerating it feels like the ignition is turned off and back on again). Also the car can be idling quite happily at a stand still and just dies!!
Not sure where to start looking for the cure. Have replaced the ECU relay as this was the fault of a previous cutting out problem 6 months ago, but now have another!! Noticed as well that the coil pack has been changed. I know that cutting out problems are common, but just need some guidance.
Any help is appreciated thanks.
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Right.
Happened again this morning. Exactly as before. There is a pattern emerging....
First, it's raining. Doesn't seem to like it.
Second, it's while pulling away.
I had bought a replacement ECU relay which I hadn't installed as it was running ok, and I wanted it to happen again so I could positively identify the relay as the fault. Having happened again, I immediately switched relays. After a little sputtering it started, but running it was bogging down as before. Got it back home and let it idle. It was idleing horribly with a very gradual drop in revs before dying. Then struggled to start, at which point I left it.
Any ideas?
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i hooked my laptop up to my mk3 gti using vag-com and found it was the engine speed control that was gone on mine :)
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Think i'm gonna clean the carb and check all the hoses and mountings for leaks. After that check the crank sensor. Failing that check the distributor. If nothing found, give up.
On that note, anyone want to buy a Mk3 Golf Gti 16V?
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Ah hah,
The sage continues. My beautiful hooning baby started having this problem a few months ago, pretty intermitent - I thought it was the immobiliser so got that disconnected at the last service. It's got 89k miles on the but there's still life in her yet.
But this cutting out thing is the pits - I live in Norfolk and HAVE to overtake massive lorries and lines of traffic on the road infrastructure here but I'm too scared too at the moment. Today it has cut out seven times in a queue of traffic boo hoo! I have to drive to Madchester this weekend. I've read the whole lot - every post on this mammoth thread. I've written down every part that's been changed or thing that's been cleaned. You have to bear with me as I'm not very technically minded - I just have a bloody great bass bin! First thing is going to be the ECU #3 which seems to have worked for some people but not everyone. I'll post back with the results but cross fingers for me out there in cyberspace please.
Cheers, Mx :wink:
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Ah hah,
The sage continues. My beautiful hooning baby started having this problem a few months ago, pretty intermitent - I thought it was the immobiliser so got that disconnected at the last service. It's got 89k miles on the but there's still life in her yet.
But this cutting out thing is the pits - I live in Norfolk and HAVE to overtake massive lorries and lines of traffic on the road infrastructure here but I'm too scared too at the moment. Today it has cut out seven times in a queue of traffic boo hoo! I have to drive to Madchester this weekend. I've read the whole lot - every post on this mammoth thread. I've written down every part that's been changed or thing that's been cleaned. You have to bear with me as I'm not very technically minded - I just have a bloody great bass bin! First thing is going to be the ECU #3 which seems to have worked for some people but not everyone. I'll post back with the results but cross fingers for me out there in cyberspace please.
Cheers, Mx :wink:
ECU number 30 ;)
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Hi again cyberspacers,
I've just got my ECU #30 :wink: changed for cost of £10 for part and free fitting from the local garage - Paul Johnson's in King's Lynn (he's brilliant). Also booked in to have my throttle body cleaned which is only an additional good idea. Watch this space - she's had no problems today but off to Madchester with her this avo...
Adios Mx
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i had this problem on my 16v it cut out driving along,luckily i put my foot
down and it came back to life. then a mile down the road cut out in the
fast lane on a duel carraigeway, turn out distributor broke up and cut hall
sender wires. took 2 weeks to source another disi but been perfect ever since
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Hello Everyone,
New here, and own a Mk3 8v gti, and you'll never guess what happened to me at the weekend :undecided:!
Drove onto a roundabout at about 30, went to accelerate and the engine was totally dead, just a low tone of it being turned over as the car was still in gear. No spluttering, just instantly nothing. Got out and pushed it out the dangerous poition it was in. Checked for anything blatent, tried it, started first time and apart from strong smell, guessing the cat not liking having a load of petrol in the system!, it's been fine since.
Think i will change relay 30 now from what i have read but if not have horrible feeling might be the crank sensor.
Just wanted to add, great thread to have to look at, at least gives some ideas on potential fixes :smiley:
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what a blinding thread! glad i found it :smiley:
My 97 8v gti starts ok....when its not raining.....takes a bit of time when its wet, however cuts out after 5mins when its at around 70degrees. Ive already cleaned what was a very dirty body. I was about to get a new distributor now thats the bottom of the list :o)
ill do the 2 relays next, (would the fuel relay effect the sender reading? as my fuel guage is kaput)
after that the crank sensor
coil
then a new distrib.
thanks to all who have posted on this the greatest thread ever! the privious owner had it to VW and they found nothing.....reading this has probably saved me a few bob!
cheers
Mike
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Hi!
Total mechanical noob here...
I recently purchased my first GTI! :grin:
I am also having this problem on occasion's, suprise suprise with a P Reg 97 golf gti 2.0 8v
I took a look in my relay box this morning and saw a black relay with the number 30 on it, is this the messed up one?
I also noticed that to stop some of the stalling, having the air con turned on (while the engine warms up) seems to help alot as it increases the revs a small amount...(will this use up all my freon even if i have the heating turned on?)
Can anyone please tell me if i can simply unplug one relay and plug a new one in? i dont want to find out my car wont start or something like that (ive only ever changed an indicator relay before lol)
Also Can anyone confirm that this fixed the losing total power while say on a moterway and the oil light flashes?
Im not as worried if it cuts out and starts again, its the not starting for 30 seconds - 1 minute part that I need to get sorted asap...
This is the only issue the car has, other than that its flawless and an amazing whip.. :evil: :laugh:
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mine had this issue.
Found out my throttle body was full of crap. took a white hanky to the inside of it and it came out not so white any more.
Since then its hasnt stalled once! (try the throttle body)
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anyone knows why my oil lights flashing... i have not yet looked at it so thought id ask, someone might know.
the oil light flashes when over 1500rpm i changed the sensor that is screwed into the right side of the cyclinder head with spade conn and rubber cover still oil flashes. i have it disconnected as this stops the light flashing? the oil mfa works still with this disconnected. is there another sensor i have missed, what about the one that is threaded into the part where the oil filter threads to..
many thanks
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maybe just dodgey wiring tp the sensor matey, pretty common tbh
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anyone knows why my oil lights flashing... i have not yet looked at it so thought id ask, someone might know.
the oil light flashes when over 1500rpm i changed the sensor that is screwed into the right side of the cyclinder head with spade conn and rubber cover still oil flashes. i have it disconnected as this stops the light flashing? the oil mfa works still with this disconnected. is there another sensor i have missed, what about the one that is threaded into the part where the oil filter threads to..
many thanks
same problem i had... you've probably been given the wrong pressure sensor... there are 2 sensors on my 1.6, one blue, one white. they are all colour coded and tbh, it was a pain in the ass getting the correct one because the people at the VW dealer here in Aberdeen insisted they had given me the correct one and they hadnt. :rolleyes: anyway, i had the same thing, anything over 1500rpm and light would flash, finally got the right sensors after alot of arguing with the VW people and all is well :smiley:
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The woes, the woes,
Methinks that at some stage on the AGG assembly line in deepest darkest Germany Helmut's missus vas sleepink vit the zoopervisor und he decided to get his rewenge on all the poor saps who would buy these piece of sh!tz engines he vas buildink!!
To recap
3 Months ago stopped halfway through a 300 mile journey, car never started again, had it towed to local garage, spent two days trying to find what was wrong, finally started, he had done nothing to it so he charge me very little as he couldn'y say what was wrong!
Much tearing out of hair, had a shoofty on here, replaced relay no 30 (ecu)
All good, not a bother from then 'till on motorway on ramp at rush hour
foot down up to about 65, then nada, just like everyone else on here, waited 15 mins, theh she started up, managed to limp home by every time it stalled dumping the clutch as if I was getting a push start, and left foot braking the rest of the time to keep the foot on the throttle(if the revs are kept above 2000 she wont stall) hair raising stuff I tell you!!
Have cleaned the throtlte body, and have a new oil breather pipe en route, will also order a 167 Fuel Pump Relay.
The car has a new dizzy in it, and when I bought it 6 months ago the guy told me it'd just had a new Crankshaft Position sensor in it.
I'm going to trade it in soon, but I want it to be running for when I do, I can't afford to ever get stranded again as it cost me work (anyone had any experience with the Audi a3 tdi quattro...???)
Meanwhile, does anyone know if it is normal for a relay to get warm when the car is running....??
My new no.30 (which is the grey made in germany one) is always warm when I feel it after stalling...
If this is normal I can get on with the other stuff, if not I need to find out why it's getting warm
Best of luck to all you 97 git (sic) owners out there may you never encounter this problem!!
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Hiya - I have a Golf Estate GL, P-reg, fuel injection... 2L
It cuts out when slowing down at junctions/traffic lights etc...
the oil light doesn't flash.
I took my car to the garage (prior to finding this fantastic forum) and they have cleaned out the mass air flow valve (I think that that is what it is called) and they now suggest that I replace the throttle body (which is too expensive for me - he quoted £400 for the part)...
I've written down all the options that have been discussed in this forum (see below), but do not know what to do next. I didn't want to go along and tell the garage their job etc. I'm not experienced with engines at all - from what I've heard I can probably replace the relays... How do you clean the throttle body - is it easy or does the garage have to do it?
How about the cam belt, can that be tested without taking it out etc? (I had a new one put in a year ago when I bought the car).
I live in Formby - about 13 miles north of Liverpool (along the coast)... - are their any garages around here that would know how to proceed, I don't think my garage has come across this before...
1. relay 30 (Hall sender relay) to be replaced
2. fuel relay replaced
3. crank sensor
4. distributer
5. throttle body dirty (clean it or replace it)
6. engine speed control
7. clean or get new oil breather pipe (and other pipes)
8. cam belt one notch out
many thanks for your help...
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I have had, and again having this problem. The first time i had the hall sender replaced (on the distributor) and also the crank angle sensor/engine speed sensor. This seemed to be the solution.
My local vw dealer thought it was a problem with the fuel relay, but that didnt fix it. Most people recommend changing this and the ecu relay. About 12 quid each from vw.
I'm oing for a new distributor cap and rotor arm next. It looks a bit worn. They are about 12 and 6 quid.
You might also want to check there is no moisture on your ht leads (the ones to and from distributor).
As for the throttle body, it is really easy to clean, and doesnt take long.
You just unclip the air hose from it and spray some carb cleaner in and if its really bad just use an old tooth brush to rub the bits of dirt away. It will just burn off then next time you have it running.
If i was you, i would go for the cheaper options first, and these you could do yourself without to much trouble.
Hope this helps
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cheers for your help admc6, I'll let you know how I get on.....
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Hey Guys ive posted in here about the same problem but I just need a direction to go in now as im running out of money Patience and time as I want to sell her soon
Mine cuts out same as everyone around 80 degrees ish then will sometimes start again straight away and sometimes ill have to wait a while! Will usually start straight off from a jump (odd?) I have so far
Cleaned the Throttle out
New Disi and Rotor arm
No 30 relay (ecu)
No 167 relay (Fuel pump)
New Ignition Coil
Im about to change all the HT leads and plugs
please can someone maybe point me in the next cheapest/most likely direction please
Thanks
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KingPin, sounds like the Hall Sensor, exactly what happened to mine in the past week. rather annoying :sad:
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To everyone having this problem i have been getting annoyed with my car cutting out, so i looked at the no30 relay and i took it apart.
Inside there is a braided wire that has been shorting out due to lack of insulation.
I have a friend that works in a VW garage and asked him to (borrow) a few new no30 relay's and they all had the same problem no insulation around the braided cable so my guess is that a new one lasts for a while then starts to short out as the cable loosens up.
i have had no problems since insulating to cable inside the relay so i suggest to anybody thats feels comfortable opening there's to have a go at it as its cheaper (free) to fix if any body needs more info as to what i have done then please let me know.
Hope you all find this helpful.
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I have exactly the same problem to my VW caddy VAN its 1.9 SDI ometimes i get the oil light flashing sometimes not! is this a differetn fault as its a diesel engine or not??
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1. relay 30 (Hall sender relay) to be replaced
2. fuel relay replaced
3. crank sensor
4. distributer
5. throttle body dirty (clean it or replace it)
6. engine speed control
7. clean or get new oil breather pipe (and other pipes)
8. cam belt one notch out
many thanks for your help...
done most (apart from replaced relays... - anyone know who I need to call to source them?)... still stalling... - but, doesn't seem to be as much. leaving it for the moment as it turns on immediately, bloody pain in the arse though!!
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I would just get them form your local vw. The ecu (30) one is £12 and the fuel pump (167) is £22. Give or take a few pence.
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I would just get them form your local vw. The ecu (30) one is £12 and the fuel pump (167) is £22. Give or take a few pence.
cheers, will do....
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I had this problem :angry:
hi mr blue thanks for the pics it helped alot . looked at mine and found a split on the lead about half way up . just wanted to no does it clip in or is it bolted ? i havent taken it out as yet ,i have small hands may be able to reach it behind the oil filter if it can be pulled out. also has the crank sensor fixed the problem for good. cheers
justaman trying to fix his gti
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I had this problem :angry:
Changed the Relay for a later white one....
still had cutting out problems. Changed the crank sensor (or pulse sensor). The wires were broken! :evil:
VW charged me £113 for a new one on trade! still flippin expensive :shocked:
You have to take off the engine mount bracket which longs your life out abit :angry:
Old against the new pulse sensor..
EDIT: went out for a long drive and it has not cut out yet (thank God)
How did you know it was the crank sensor, can you visibly see it prior to having to take it out???
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Just as an update.. - I replaced the fuel relay (number 167) to no avail. I ordered the ecu relay at the same time, but the damn garage sent me number 109 instead..... - they said that my car didn't have the number 30 in it (I took it out and quoted the part number this time - should have done it straight away!!!!)...
fingers crossed this works, I pick it up tomorrow!
BTW - I have a feeling it might, because since I've fiddled with the relays my car has cut out more!!!!
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Barbera,
Im having very similar issues at the mo and like you its doing my head in, have you had your car plugged into vag-com?
Worth the money to get it done to be honest! saves changing parts that are ok!
issues with mine -
cutting out ( random stalling )
wont idle very well
wont rev past 5000rpm
had it vag-commed last week the errors - air mass sensor, lambda probe
changed air mass sensor - started to rev all the way around to 6000rpm ( lasted a day!!! )
changed lambda sensor - stopped the random cutting out!!!
change relays - 167 and 30 did nothing!
found some broken cables from the air mass sensor to the lambda probe, re-soldered think i wasted my money on the new lambda probe but ah well!
still not idiling or reving past 500o rpm... gonna get in plugged in again this week.
im sure this will be a very straight forward fix, lots of people seem to have had the same problem but no one really knows what it is!!!grrrrr. keep me posted if you have any joy!!!
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Cheers Rob,
I'll try the relay number 30 and if that doesn't work I'll do like you said - cheaper than changing the throttle body which is what my mechanic said (I don't think he really knew what was going on at all)....
I'll keep you posted (I would have written earlier but I lost the web page!!! - it was only when someone posted again that I got the address back - an easy web page to remember as well!).....
Mine just 'randomly' stalls when I come up to a stop... - but I don't have any other probs with the revs.... It idles at just under 1000 - but, drops to zero in a split second when stopping.
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yeah sounds very similar to mine! think my rev-limiter issue is another weird and wonderfull electrical problem....!! getting it plugged in on thursday and a mate who used to work at vw is taking a look friday! im pretty sure its not the throttle body tho, be a little carefull on what people suggest on forums! as i have found out the hard way, (spent sh!t loads of cash on parts that where fine) luckily i got a friend with the vag-com but even if you had to 50 bux its well worth it!
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Well, reading all 31 pages :sad: it seems pretty obvious that there are a number of different causes for this problem, It is not always helpful when posters jump in telling everyone that (whatever fixed it for them) IS - in fact - MUST be the solution!
Here's my bit to add to the confusion:
Had problem similar to original post (note now that some are complaining of different problems to the thread title and there are at least 2 completely differing faults being reported in this thread - probably more).
Just to clarify my fault - 8 months ago car (8v GTI '97) cut out after thrashing it a bit, approx 10 mins into journey after starting from cold. Tried relay 30 (as I already had one in car being aware of the issue) - no good - stuck on motorway, got towed in to VW dealers - changed coil - fixed problem and worked fine until 2 weeks ago. Began cutting out under similar circumstances -10 mins into journey after hard driving - (I'm straight onto Motorway). Did this on 3 or 4 different occasions - just died but all electrics OK and car cranked over fine but appeared to have no spark. Left for a few hours and all but the last time started fine afterwards - BUT the last time wouldn't start so had to leave it in a carpark - breakdown driver sent for it next day he said it started fine. Told him to take to dealers anyway for check. They said runs for 10 mins then cuts and it IS the main ECU (not the relay). Over €1000! I told them to first rectify leaking coolant from where top hose meets engine (by temp sensor) and also leak from joint of newly fitted exhaust system. Also to confirm with VAG computer that it is definitely the ECU.
They said yes yes etc etc. Just got it back - they HAVEN'T fixed any of the above so told them to stuff it and I'll be claiming for a refund of the 3 hours labour they charged me - as well as passing this on to VW Spain. They gave me a discount but also flattened my brand new battery! I am going to fix coolant leak (it seems obvious to me that as this sensor feeds back to the ECU that this could then send a STOP signal to protect engine from oveheating). I will also check the fans - which I haven't heard come on for some weeks even though outside temp is over 40 degrees and the engine is always really hot when it cuts. This is something else I asked them to do but they "knew better".
If it's still not working after this will look at getting a used ECU for €65 and put it on myself.
Will post back.
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Maybe I should clarify why I am less than impressed with the dealer:
First item on bill "checking and verifying battery" - told them when it was taken in (cuz at first they reported no fault found and car was working fine) - it could NOT be battery as all electrics are fine and turns over really well!
Second item on bill "Checking alternator & circuitry" - see above!
At bottom of bill "customer is advised that coolant is leaking from (where top hose meets engine)" - no **** sherlock!
Followed by "exhaust is making a noise" - well I never (actually I DID like the above repor this when car went in.......
Good news - all this hassle has sped up my getting my new Audi A3 2.0TDI 170CV - should have some fun with that while getting the Golf sorted...... :smiley:
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Good news - all this hassle has sped up my getting my new Audi A3 2.0TDI 170CV - should have some fun with that while getting the Golf sorted...... :smiley:
:laugh:
cheers for all the info....
I'm now praying that the ecu relay will work (even though it hadnt for a fair number of people). I had no idea that there was an actual ecu rather than just a relay!! (i must admit that until I read the thread I didn't even know that relays existed!).... Anyway what I really want to know is why VW aren't doing anything about this problem as it must be spread throughout all 96/97 VW golf fuel injected vehicles (I've seen other forums where people are saying similar things)...... will they not do anything about it???
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latest...
after replacing the 167 I noticed that my car cut out more.
I then replaced the 30 (ecu) and it stalled a couple of times...
I took out the new 167 and put the old one back - it has not stalled since, but poss a little early to celebrate (only did about 15 miles, but with quite a lot of stops.)...
fingers crossed......
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hi justaman here,i think ive found the my cutting out problem. {i hope}
afrter reading this thread i located my crank shaft sensor in between the oil filter and the engine mount, [using a light} squeezed my hand through the gap and felt a sensor, it came up beside the dip stick over some pipes and clipped in to a next plug which then lead in to wires near the starter motor . the wire is split near the dip stick.
it was really wet over the weekend and the car wouldnt start at all with oil light flashing. today it started and cut out for a few times and then ticked over .
i bent the wire and it cut out , i repeated it again same thing . dont no if this is any help ,but you never no...
also my p reg and k reg gti 2l 8v engines have a few differences is that right ??
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the k reg 4 door has a longer throttle body and i cant find the sensor i found on the 2 door p reg {previous post}also the p reg engine seems to sit lower than the k . is that normal ,or is it a smaller engine ...1.8 ??
hope some one can help ,cheers
justaman trying to fix his gti :cool:
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Cheers Rob,
I'll try the relay number 30 and if that doesn't work I'll do like you said - cheaper than changing the throttle body which is what my mechanic said (I don't think he really knew what was going on at all)....
I'll keep you posted (I would have written earlier but I lost the web page!!! - it was only when someone posted again that I got the address back - an easy web page to remember as well!).....
Mine just 'randomly' stalls when I come up to a stop... - but I don't have any other probs with the revs.... It idles at just under 1000 - but, drops to zero in a split second when stopping.
i had this on my 2.0 8v when i first got it. i cleaned the throttle body with carb cleaner & disconnect the breather pipe. the breather pipe was seemed clean, not blocked, no problem until i went to put it back on. as i was putting it back i notice that part of the tube didnt seem as stiff as the rest of it when i sqeezed it between mine fingers. so when the engine was running and making a vacuum in the tube the walls of the tube would collapse with the pressure restricting flow. i chopped the bad bit off with some cutters and connected all back up. no more idleing at just under 1000 revs, no more dropping to zero in a split second when stopping! all good.
check the breather. you might be pleasently suprised
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this is the breather i mean.
(http://links.pictures.aol.com/pic/3090W398R-EAX7ufztWdEg8WU5VtpLmc6Mcvv4xQp5Fd3Ig=_l.jpg)
remove it, make sure it isnt bloked. checked it for damaged/soft areas. chop or replace it. re-fit & fingers crossed it will sort out the stalling and rev dropping problem.
:wink:
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Today i fitted a new ignition switch to HOPEFULLY stop my battery from draining every time i dont use it for 4 - 5 days. drives me mad. also the switch now allows me to have the stereo working on the key. woop
now to try and stop the cutting out when driving along. mostly this happens during motorway driving. it'll die, oil light flashes, then i have to knock it out of gear and put it back in while coasting. basically a 70mph bump lol
so time to fit this & see what happens. or preferably see what stops happening!
(http://links.pictures.aol.com/pic/3090W398R-EAX7ufztWdEg8WU69hc2k1N6bvv4xQp5Fd3Ig=_l.jpg)
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the k reg 4 door has a longer throttle body and i cant find the sensor i found on the 2 door p reg {previous post}also the p reg engine seems to sit lower than the k . is that normal ,or is it a smaller engine ...1.8 ??
hope some one can help ,cheers
justaman trying to fix his gti :cool:
Hi,had loads of problems with cutting out & oil light flashing.Replaced relay No,30,full distributor,ect,ect!Got some sound advice in the end from a small independant VW guy,who suggested replacing the crankshaft sensor,which plugs in one end & the flanged sensor screws in underneth the oil filter into the crankcase.This item i brought from Euro car parts for about £55,not main dealer type at £165!The car drives like new!No issues at all,even considering its a 1997 R reg GTI with 115k on the clock.I hope my experiances help you guys solve your problems,i know too well how expensive & frustrating it can be!Best of luck,Regards,Mark
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Happy New Year!!
I've been looking forward to returning to this thread to post my own solution to this 'window-smashing' capacity of a car problem. You can add my MK 3 2.0 8V GTI to the list of vehicles with faulty crank angle sensors!
I got an auto electrician to come out with his VAG system to pin point electrical faults - there were 4 on my car! Lambda sensor, crank angle sensor, mass air flow sensor and hall sensor. The hall sensor on a MK3 is part of the distributor, so I replaced it with one from the scrap yard - but didn't stop the cutting out. Then replaced mass air flow sensor - engine idling nicely, but still cutting out. Got a used crank angle sensor off ebay [seem to be a steady supply of them on ebay] for £20. It wasn't actually that hard to replace, you do have to remove the front engine mount and starter motor to get the alan key at it, you don't need to remove the oil filter as it says in the Haynes. The car is running perfectly now and I'm confident about driving distances again! :)
I haven't changed the lambda sensor yet, but will do when the exhaust system needs replacing soon.
Hope this helps someone out!
All the best!
Jonathan
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Hi All,
Another 1998 GTi 8V here.
I read through this thread a while ago and changed the ECU Relay - That was 4 months ago and the car was fine up until a couple of weeks ago when I changed the oil and filter.
The car has cut out a couple of times since - both times on Dual Carriagways / fast A roads travelling at approx 60mph. So reading through again I wander whether I may have disturbed the crank angle sensor wiring as its located just above the filter.
So irritating when you think you have fixed it and it comes back again.
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Hi All,
Another 1998 GTi 8V here.
I read through this thread a while ago and changed the ECU Relay - That was 4 months ago and the car was fine up until a couple of weeks ago when I changed the oil and filter.
The car has cut out a couple of times since - both times on Dual Carriagways / fast A roads travelling at approx 60mph. So reading through again I wander whether I may have disturbed the crank angle sensor wiring as its located just above the filter.
So irritating when you think you have fixed it and it comes back again.
Andy.
tell me about it! mine started doing exactly the same christmas eve after 6 months of trouble free driving from a previous cutting out issue!
sounds to me you could of knocked the wires for that crank angle sensor ( speed sensor ), just spent half hour on the phone to a local vw specialist nr me (volksmania), considering i have changed more or less everything else he reckons that the wiring on those sensors is notoriously bad and symptoms are it will just cut out randomly.... he said it would usually take 10 mins or so before it will re-start but mine tends to start straight away. did yours? Rob
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It takes a couple of goes cranking it over - but nothing like ten minutes.
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well ill be having a play on friday with a sensor, ill let you know how it goes!
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Forgot to mention;
I have a spare crank angle sensor [tested & working] for a MK3 VR6. I bought it thinking it would fit my 8V GTI. It has a very small slit in the middle of the outer black casing of the cable, but this has been sealed with insulating tape and is as good as new [and is nothing to do with the common fault on these sensors - which is inside the housing of the actual sensor]. £25 seems like a fair price [including postage]. Please email me at jhulson@europe.com if interested.
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Changed my Crankshaft sensor today. The plastic casing of the wire was very brittle and just crumbled when you touched it exposing the bare wire - certainly needed changing
Looking back at the history - after replacing the ECU relay it went for 6 months, 6000 miles with no cutting out, i then changed the oil and it cut out twice.
After removing the old sensor today and looking at the state of the wire it makes sense that I may have caused the problem by knocking the wire on the oil change
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Hello i have been having this problem and just got round to buying the relay 30 does any one have any pictures were its located so i can change it...so i can show my dad to change it?
Also went to the garage today i told them about the relay but they dident even check and said change the coil.....any one heard of this being the problem?
Thanks very much
Sorry forgot to say its a 8v colour concept i was told it was under a panel under next to the driver seat by the garage but looking at one of the pictures posted here i am not sure
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Hello i have been having this problem and just got round to buying the relay 30 does any one have any pictures were its located so i can change it...so i can show my dad to change it?
Also went to the garage today i told them about the relay but they dident even check and said change the coil.....any one heard of this being the problem?
Thanks very much
Sorry forgot to say its a 8v colour concept i was told it was under a panel under next to the driver seat by the garage but looking at one of the pictures posted here i am not sure
The relays are located with the fuses. There's a plastic cover you need to pop off under the steering wheel. Sorry I don't have any pictures. I'm sure you'll find it, though.
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mine did the whole cutting out and starting up again within a split second on motorway speeds, and cutting out at idle sometimes. changed the ecu relay(30) was fine up until today, cut out and started up again pulling off a roundabout. nightmare.
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hello all
i'm new to this forum, but i liked it so much, you all helped me while fixing my MK3 3E golf. here is my current problem:
2 days ago the engine couldnt start at all, just the starter motor runnin the engine and no more, while doing that the oil lamp keep flashing. so i thought about the fuel pump, any how, i kept tracing the problem till today, and i found strange thing:
i disconnected the fuel pump plug and tested the 1st and last pins with the AVmeter while ignition is on, it reads 12 volts which seems to be OK, when i plug test lamp to these pins, the lamp wont start.
then, i ran out 2 wires from the battary to the fuel pump and it's working perfectly. pluged it again to the plug and still not working.
i changed the fuel pump relay, and checked the spark plug working fine, crank position sensor ready voltage between pin1 and pin3.
anyone help and tell me wht can i test more, i dont want to spend alot of money to try changing relays and sensors. also i cant connect it to VAG soon because i'm very far away from it.
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Does the car turn over when you try and start it?
If so i would check to see if spark plugs are getting a voltage first. just pull out one of the HT leads and put a screw in the end and place near engine block. (Make sure you hold the lead with something suitable). Having a friend around helps with this, unless you have long arms.
Then it could get complicated. Best to put it on vag com if you can after that, as it will show (should show) faults with any sensors.
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:rolleyes:
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Intermittent fault which gradually got worse. Discovered oil leaking in to rubbish Mirelli distributor. Hall sender covered in oil and metal filings (from inside of cap where play in rotor spindle scraped it around inside of cap).
Replacement recon Bosh distributor (inc. new Hall sender unit) & new coil for good measure. All in £40 inc VAT from Volksmania (South West). Bargain.
Most importantly VAG com failed to identify a fault. After replacing these parts she is now running gooooooood! :cool:
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First up thankyou all very much for a very informative/gem of a thread. I have a 98 MkIII 8v GTi like many here, and like many of you here It has been cutting out intermittantly whilst drivng for quite some time. I am sure a lot of you can symapathise when I say its a f***ing pain in the arse and dangerous to boot!
Anyway after reading this I replaced ECU relay #30 and after three weeks of driving in all conditions,touch wood, it hasn't cut out once. I would definatley recommend replacing this relay first If you are having the cut out with oil light problem. It is one of the cheaper solutions and seems to work, for me at least.
Once again, thankyou all for your informative contributions contained in this epic thread and best of luck to those who continue to sit it out on the hard shoulder.
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Further to this I urge people to check the wiring going into the throttle body. I had an idling issue where I'd have to hold it on the throttle when cold, once warmed up it'd idle very low. VAGCOM brought up throttle position sensor, I swapped throttle bodies over and all sorts, turned out to be the wiring in the plastic harness was baked to hell because it's sat above the exhaust manifold. We repaired the connections and problem solved.
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I've had the throttle body cleaned, and the engine works perfectly.
good luck to all of you with a similar problem...
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need some help iv asked about this before and wanna no if you guys think its relay 30???? when the oil gets to 84degrees it cuts out although since iv had it iv done 30 miles a day up the m6 and its never gone above 70 dg so dont no if it cuts out still to scared to give it beans on the motorway just in case. once it cools down it starts fine and off you go again need to fix it before someone buys it as i dont wanna let them or the car down so any help would be fantastic
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Couldn't resist adding to the mother of all THREADS! :grin:
I'm a first time VW owner, got myself a '95 GTi 8valve and have been hooked on this forum since!
Car started with poor idle (would stall out from cold unless you kept revs up and cut out approaching junctions etc) and would 'bog down' when accelerating from low revs!
Changed so far:
HT leads
Spark plugs
Distrib cap + Rotor arm
New battery(wasn't staying charged)
Vac pipes checked and changed
Not too expensive so far! After picking car garage mechanic had cleared codes and told me it needed a run.
Car holding idle better but still not smooth and bogging down issue at low revs continues.
After 60-70 mile journey with three stops (including high speed blast on dual carriage) was few miles from home doing 30mph power started to go and car cut out!
Started again, did 100 yards and cut out. Then would turn over and not fire? Slight hot smell whilst turning over. No lights coming on when cutting out. :cry:
Saved from major rear ending by salt of the earth builder types and abandoned car at the side of road.
Will suggest to mechanic looking at following, can anyone advise me if I am pointing out the right stuff!
ECU relay 30
Fuel pump relay 167
Crank sensor
Hall sensor
Earth and wiring faults
Clean the throttle body
After two days of reading this thread brain is spinning with all the tales of woe and heartache and empty wallets. Need some GTiforum genius to make sure I get my local mechanic to do right stuff in right order.
Cheers to everyone who has so far taken the time to put there stories on here. Stewart
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I'd get the throttle body cleaned first (it was the last thing on the list that I tried..) - of course, now I've said that it will be something entirely different. The thing that annoyed me most about this was that the vw garages had no idea what the problemjavascript:void(0); was ....... it took my dad's mechanic about an hour to ask a mate to see what could be the problem.....
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Will try that, but by the way this thread has gone I'm not holding my breath.
Thank God for this forum tho, somebody with the knowledge and cash should take VW on, they are cashing in on their poor workmanship and lack of knowledge.
No bloody different from all the other major manufactures!
Thanks for getting back tho! Will update post as I spend my cash! :sick:
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GOOD LUCK
I'd given up hope too - then discovered that my mate hadn't cleaned the throttle body after all (cleaned a hose or something, it was me that had got it wrong btw...
I agree, thank god for this forum... :smiley:
Will try that, but by the way this thread has gone I'm not holding my breath.
Thank God for this forum tho, somebody with the knowledge and cash should take VW on, they are cashing in on their poor workmanship and lack of knowledge.
No bloody different from all the other major manufactures!
Thanks for getting back tho! Will update post as I spend my cash! :sick:
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Hi guys and girls,
I'm new to this forum, but have the oil light flashing - cutting out issues as described here.
I've replaced the ECU relay which didn't do anything, and am now going to try the Crank sensor. But I have heard it refered to with loads of different names. Can someone please tell me if these are all the same thing, or different:
- crank angle sensor
- crank position sensor
- engine speed sensor
- engine crank sensor
- crankshaft impulse sender
I assume these all refer to the sensor by the oil filter / engine mount?
Cheers
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Chris I'm no expert as newbie to all this VW madness, but I think Crank position sensor, crank sensor, engine speed sensor are all different names for same thing!
I phoned Europarts today, asked for it by a couple of names and the guys there said it was the same thing.
Price was £52 + vat, if you find them elsewhere cheaper post on here as I am trying to save myself cash.
Hope that helps, but as I said there are fair more clued up bods on here!
Good luck mate
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I recently bought a 95 Gti 8v that has these exact symptoms, oil light on revs drop and then stops! I immediatly thought fuel relay as I'd a scirocco inj that had a similar problem and that was the cause. It drives ok for first few miles then stalls, then stalls irratically at high and low revs......including at 60mph on motorway!
I've replaced the fuel pump relay 19106383c (no 167 I think) as well as the Hall sensor relay 165906381 (no30) as suggested and it hasn't made any difference.
I rang VW regarding ECU relay and guy said none listed, that it doesn't have one. There was a Contact Relay 7mo951253A (no4 I think)that could be it. Would anybody know if this is the ECU relay, or if not would they have a part number for it.
Any other help or advice would be grreatly appreciated as I'm at my wits end!!!!!! :cry:
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deffo get the throttle body cleaned. My mechanic said that the engine oil drops on it and dirties it....
I recently bought a 95 Gti 8v that has these exact symptoms, oil light on revs drop and then stops! I immediatly thought fuel relay as I'd a scirocco inj that had a similar problem and that was the cause. It drives ok for first few miles then stalls, then stalls irratically at high and low revs......including at 60mph on motorway!
I've replaced the fuel pump relay 19106383c (no 167 I think) as well as the Hall sensor relay 165906381 (no30) as suggested and it hasn't made any difference.
I rang VW regarding ECU relay and guy said none listed, that it doesn't have one. There was a Contact Relay 7mo951253A (no4 I think)that could be it. Would anybody know if this is the ECU relay, or if not would they have a part number for it.
Any other help or advice would be grreatly appreciated as I'm at my wits end!!!!!! :cry:
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Chris I'm no expert as newbie to all this VW madness, but I think Crank position sensor, crank sensor, engine speed sensor are all different names for same thing!
I phoned Europarts today, asked for it by a couple of names and the guys there said it was the same thing.
Price was £52 + vat, if you find them elsewhere cheaper post on here as I am trying to save myself cash.
Hope that helps, but as I said there are fair more clued up bods on here!
Good luck mate
Yeah I phoned Europarts and was pleased at that price as VW wanted around £170..!! there was some german/sweedish place, but they wanted around £150 ish.
I had the codes read on my ecu and it was the crank sensor, my mate then cleared the codes and told me to run it until the fault happens again, and if the same code come up, then he would help me change the sensor...... But since clearing the code, it hasn't happened...... I'm sure it will soon though :)
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Is the ECU relay just another name for the Hall Sensor Relay (No30) that I've already replaced?????
Should also have said, it has a K&N fitted which i'm changing as soon as I get the original airbox, just incase that could have any bearing on it.
I'm going out to clean the throttle body and if that doesn't work looks like the crank sensor :sick:
Is this the correct part from GSF
92580 CRANKSH IMPULSE SENDER G3/VENTO 2.0 ADY/AEP/AGG/AKR/ABF £42.30
Fantastic site btw lads!!!!
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Hey all, just to say that I changed the crank position sensor (from Europarts approx £50) on Thursday.
The car has been spot on ever since :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
It was a bit of a biatch to change though....
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superb..... have a great christmas... :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Hey all, just to say that I changed the crank position sensor (from Europarts approx £50) on Thursday.
The car has been spot on ever since :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
It was a bit of a biatch to change though....
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:smiley: Nice one, glad someones got there 8v back on the road!
I'm still throwing my money at a car that is not working properly, continued issues with poor idle and hesitation on acceleration.
:embarassed:
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Had mine put on computor today, crank sensor apparantly, so got new one hopefully fitting tomorrow .....fingers crossed it sorts it :smiley:
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Right, done my crank sensor a few weeks back, and the car is still running fine with no cutting out....... Approx £50 from Europarts.
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A massive thread with 36 pages, lol
I've read a few pages, and seem like people do different things to sort this problem:
1. Clean the throttle body
2. Change the ECU relay 165906381
3. Crank sensor
So what would be the first thing to do?
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A massive thread with 36 pages, lol
I've read a few pages, and seem like people do different things to sort this problem:
1. Clean the throttle body
2. Change the A4 relay 165906381
3. Crank sensor
So what would be the first thing to do?
Check for split breather pipes
Clean TB
Then replace ECU and Fuel Relay
Crank shaft sensor
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Just hoping someone who has had (and solved) the type of cutting out issue I am having is still reading this thread. :cry:
Originally my poor idle and hesitation on acceleration issues were solved by soldering two loose wires! (Had replaced ht leads, plugs, coil, CTS. Dizzy cap, rotor arm and battery!)
The issue now is cutting out (no oil light flashing) after 10-15 mins of driving, car just dies like shuting off ignition( happened on last two journeys). Ran car from cold 3 times this weekend, idles fine for 10 mins, car comes up to temp or just below 90 then cuts out! Can't restart immediately, once it cools down restarts fine then stalls at 90.
Car is 95 gti 8 valve.
Have ordered relays 30 and 167 as cheapest fixes first but have been told it could be Hall or Crank position sensors.........is this right or could it be oil temp switch/sensor or more loose wiring problems.
Would really appreciate some help on fix for this specific cutting out as I am now out of money! :sick:
Thanks all, Stewart
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Hi can anyone confirm that this will fit a 98 8v GTI - may be of use to some others if it will as seems cheap
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Crankshaft-position-Sensor-fits-SEAT-IBIZA-Toledo_W0QQitemZ370198703655QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item56318fee27 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Crankshaft-position-Sensor-fits-SEAT-IBIZA-Toledo_W0QQitemZ370198703655QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item56318fee27)
Thanks
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I emailed the company yesterday with details regarding my 95 plate 8 valve asking whether the sensor will fit direct. Will post when I get a reply.
Stewart
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Just hoping someone who has had (and solved) the type of cutting out issue I am having is still reading this thread. :cry:
Originally my poor idle and hesitation on acceleration issues were solved by soldering two loose wires! (Had replaced ht leads, plugs, coil, CTS. Dizzy cap, rotor arm and battery!)
The issue now is cutting out (no oil light flashing) after 10-15 mins of driving, car just dies like shuting off ignition( happened on last two journeys). Ran car from cold 3 times this weekend, idles fine for 10 mins, car comes up to temp or just below 90 then cuts out! Can't restart immediately, once it cools down restarts fine then stalls at 90.
Car is 95 gti 8 valve.
Have ordered relays 30 and 167 as cheapest fixes first but have been told it could be Hall or Crank position sensors.........is this right or could it be oil temp switch/sensor or more loose wiring problems.
Would really appreciate some help on fix for this specific cutting out as I am now out of money! :sick:
Thanks all, Stewart
Dude, i'd get your car hooked up to a scanner. I took mine to my cousins garage, and he plugged his "snap-on" scanner into it, and it came up with the crank sensor fault, changed it - job done. It may cost a couple of quid to do, but at least you can be sure then...
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Hey Chris,
Cheers for the info.
Managed to pull up to the garage yesterday as the car was doing it's cutting out not starting trick. Pure luck really!
As it turned it the the coil was producing no spark to plugs or dizzy!
Bloody thing was only breaking down randomly. Changed coil 5 minute job and £65 later and its all sorted.....well fingers crossed anyway! Done just under 200 mile mixed motorway and b roads and she hasnt missed a beat! :grin:
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Hi an internet search has led me to your forum. I hope someone can help.
I have a Mk3 VR6 and bought a Mk3 GTi 8v 6 months ago for the daily 50 mile round trip to work.
It has a very frustrating cutting out issue which my partner and I are struggling to solve.
When she is about 82-84 degrees on the oil temp the engine cuts out and will not immediately restart. When it happens (which is not every journey), the engine revs struggle and seem to intermittently cut in and out before the engine dies.The oil light does at this point come on. Once the oil temp is up past this, it runs fine.
So far we have done:
ECU relay
Distributor
Plugs & leads
Throttle body cleaned
Coolant temp sender
For other reasons the lambda sensor has also been changed.
I am looking to try an fuel pump relay as the next option. Anything else anyone would recommend trying?
I hope you can help.
Thanks
Steve
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Well just about made it back from my local VW dealer after cutting out several times. :angry:
I have ordered a fuel pump relay which will arrive on Tuesday AM.
As a couple of former colleagues work there, they brought out one of the technicians to speak to me. He said from the sypmtoms I gave him and the list of items already replaced, his bet is on a crank postion sensor.
Fingers crossed, especially as it's not a 50p part!
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Definitely sounds like your crank position sensor. Get it checked out.
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Hi there, i hope someone can help me, have no idea about cars, i have a mk3 gti 2.0, having trouble starting on and off (sometimes it goes ok) but getting worse lately, but afetr a min it will start fine. also over the past 3 months, it has cut out at 40mph ish few times and once at 10mph. oil light starts flashing when it does this. car has been tested on vw machine for faults but showed nothing and had electrical guy round that machine picked up nothing but said to replace the fuel pump relay, which i did but no change. i having been reading all the forums but have ended up with a whole list of things i could changem can anyone help please :rolleyes:
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Hi I have been having the cutting out problem after not using the car for 5 months. I have replaced most of the stuff recommended by others on this forum. The car starts fine & ticks over from cold. It will drive without missing a beat for 2 miles then cut out and nothing will start it for 30-45 mins.
Next thing I want to change is the fuel pump relay but I have the problem that my car - a 2000(X) MK3.5 Colour concept convertible - doesn't seem to have a relay marked 167.
Others have said the fuel pump relay is situated bottom right and the Haynes manual agrees but I have relay no. 53 in that position which, searching around, seems to be for the horn or fan.
Anyone else with my model or have a non-167 FP relay? The car has the AGG engine but maybe VW fitted the MK4 fusebox along with the lights, steering wheel etc. ?
Cheers for any suggestions Guys. Also anyone in the Aylesbury area with a Vag-Com wouldn't mind hooking me up?
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Well it's finally happened :sad: driving to work in my p reg mk3 gti 8v this morning the car cut out for a split second,the rev counter went nuts and there was a clicking coming from the fusebox,the car has been down on power under acceleration for a while but I've cleaned the tb and the maf but it's not cured the problem,the 167 and 30 relays both get hot but my number 30 is grey but made in Indonesia? could it of been this clicking like mad when the car cut out?
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Hi I got the fuel pump relay and fitted it but still the same prob. Also bought brand new distributor from VW which comes fully built - although I'd already changed the cap & rotor arm. But it's still cutting out & refusing to start until it's cooled down.
One constant seems to be that the engine dies when the oil temperature reaches 76 deg. Up until this point it runs and drives perfectly. Anyone got any ideas?
Pleeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaasse !
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Ok fingers crossed i may have sorted mine,Changed the relays first and that made no difference then changed the coil pack and cleaned out the throttle body,that made the car run better and smoother but still had the problem of it cutting out randomly,so have now just had the crank sensor changed which i could of done myself had the previous owner not majorly rounded the allen bolt off which resulted in having to take the oil filter and oil cooler off to get it out, :angry: And it seeeems to have cured the problem,its not cut out since wednesday and the oil temp went up to 90 degrees lastnite while sitting in traffic,so id say this problem is down to the crank sensor! but time will tell,keep u posted with an update soon. :smiley:
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Afternoon chaps.
I have a 94 GTI 16v mk 3 which is having this all too familiar cutting out problem. It initially started doing it a few weeks back when driving round town. I had the coil and distributer replaced which appeared to cure it. However after driving from Essex to Blackpool it cut out on the motorway whilst doing 70mph. managed to get hold of a second hand fuel pump relay. Changed this and the car got all the rest of the way to Blackpool without cutting out once.
However on the return journey the car must have cut out at least 7-8 times and is now becoming an absolute joke. I have read through this thread and am struggling to understand what the problem could be. mine doesn't cut out when idle only when driving. There seems to be no pattern to it. I haven't the money to take it to a garage to get it diagnosed and them to say they can't find anything wrong with it!
Somebody please help how do I cure this weird problem. if people could explain what parts I should try I will be eternally grateful!!
Thanks
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Hi All,
I've been reading this thread with GREAT interest!!
Got a P reg 1997 8v GTI...
Its only having problems on startup...
When you turn the car over from cold, the red engine oil pressure light will flash..The car starts and immediately the revs drop and it shuts down...
I can get it going again by just revving for about 10 seconds as the revs fall....after this it's fine and will drive perfectly WITHOUT suddenly cutting out.....
Could the cure be the same #30 relay?
The oil light that comes on is the Engine Oil Pressure warning light if I'm right, so does this been the Engine Oil Pressure sensor is knackered?
Thanks!
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Afternoon chaps.
I have a 94 GTI 16v mk 3 which is having this all too familiar cutting out problem. It initially started doing it a few weeks back when driving round town. I had the coil and distributer replaced which appeared to cure it. However after driving from Essex to Blackpool it cut out on the motorway whilst doing 70mph. managed to get hold of a second hand fuel pump relay. Changed this and the car got all the rest of the way to Blackpool without cutting out once.
However on the return journey the car must have cut out at least 7-8 times and is now becoming an absolute joke. I have read through this thread and am struggling to understand what the problem could be. mine doesn't cut out when idle only when driving. There seems to be no pattern to it. I haven't the money to take it to a garage to get it diagnosed and them to say they can't find anything wrong with it!
Somebody please help how do I cure this weird problem. if people could explain what parts I should try I will be eternally grateful!!
Thanks
Sounds like crankshaft sensor.
Try posting in the vag-com forum part might be someone near you who has it on their laptop that could scan it for a pint or something.
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Hi Guys
Been having the same problem, MK3 P-Reg GTi, Cutting out at any speed with the revs dropping to 0 and the oil light flashes.
Have done all the usual things recomended - changed the dizzy cap, leads and plugs - but no change to the problem.
So moved onto the next things to change - changed relay 30/167 and fuse slot 15 - still nothing so after this happening for 2 weeks i took it to my local garage where they plugged a computer into it!
Error - 00513 - Engine Speed Sensor - G28 - Brilliant!! that will be the crankshaft sensor then!
But after having a quick look about the engine i cant seem to find where it should go - can anybody tell me where abouts it is and how much work is going to be involved!
Cheers
Mitch
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Im writing to see if anyone has found a cure to this problem of cutting out and oil light flashing, may of found a solution if anyone is willing to put to the test, iv got a vento 2.0 8v gl with the same problems havent bothered with usual tried and tested methods thats in this thread, so done lots of reseach and found there may be confilcting messages with the service light that appear on the dash, iv reset the service interval using the guide in the maintaince section and its been fine for a few weeks, i will keep monitoring it i could be wrong but its worth a try,i havent replaced nothing just reset the service light.
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Hi new on this site however have been through this whole forum about cutting out problems and car wont start. I have Golf gti mk3 2.0l R reg 97 model. Ive had the cutting out happening not in any particular situations it would just die no flashing oil light though. Now car wont start at all!! Have had all the basic changed HT leads plugs distributer cap. I am picking up relay 30 today from vw. Ther is something which no one has mentioned and i dont know if anyone has had this!! when my ignition is on and i look under the bonnet(engine not running) the accelerator cable does a twiching movement back and forth is this common?? :undecided:
Relay 30 hasnt worked will try the crank shaft sensor!!
Have replaced crank angle sensor which has worked a treat when i examined cables on the sensor they were badly damaged and probably shorting this was causing throttle cable to twitch. If anybody has a problem with no spark then suggest replacing the crank sensor i got mine for £40 if i had only replaced this first would have saved a few quid anyway all working good and can stop pulling my hair out! would just like to say thanks to everyone on this site for there advice as wouldnt have got there without it!
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Well this weekend has been a busy one!!
After searching on here to see what the problems might be I have changed the following:
HT Leads
Spark Plugs
Coil pack
Dizzy Cap
Relay 30
Relay 167
I did all of these at the same time to see if that made any difference - it didn't!
So after searching a little bit more and plugging it into the Vag-Com it returned the Crankcase sensor error.
After talking to a mate of mine he said it was a fairly simple task but to make it easier we might as well do an oil change and remove the oil filter as to give us a little bit more room.
We had the car up on the ramp - removed the oil & filter and then moved on to removing the front engine mount (pain in the ar$e) When I removed the Crankcase sensor the whole thing just fell apart in my hand - that was the problem as I have driven from Stokenchurch all the way to Southend and back and then out to Milton Keynes without the car even missing a beat!
For all those that are having this problem if you haven't changed this sensor I recommend doing it!
Cheers for all the help guys
Mitch
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I've had this for a while, thought I nailed it this week with a coilpack and a throttle body clean (quick one cos wasn't bad) and done 300 miles then did it again last night!! :(
I'd tried vagcom earlier this week and it showed no faults, but could the crank sensor still be faulty? Does it only show at the time?
Btw I can't always connect to the engine module on vagcom but when i try abs can always connect, what could cause that? (read somewhere on here baud rate shud be set to 4800, which I Havent done, so hopefully that's why!!) Wondering if there's an earth issue.. Gonna grt a multimeter and check grounds specially the ecu earth later..
So far I've done,
Relay 30,167
Tb clean
Coil pack
Any ideas greatly received a it's my commuter to work! And it's getting me down somewhat now! :(
note, just realised this happened about 24hrs after putting a piperx panel filter in, though surely that wouldnt cause it would it?
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hi there, jus thought id join the cutting out club, thought vdubs were mena be reliable ?
mines started doin this now, iv replaced the relays, coil, dizzy cap, rotor arm and crank sensor,
it was driving fine til the other day wen i give it some and it jus died on me, rev counter dropped oil light flashed, waited a few mins to cool down then it started up and went a little bit more but died again it seems to be doin it once it gets hot ? if its cold it will go fine til it gets to a certain temp ?
i think summin electrical must be breaking down wen it gets too hot ? im thinkin about tryin the hall sender next although alot of people are sayin the crank sensor cures this ? i have replaced this but its got me thinkin i might have a faultly one thats breakin down on me when it gets too hot ?
also does anyone know would the oil pressure sensor or coolant temp sensor cause it to cut out ?
and could i jus plug in and try another ecu or are they coded to the key ???
ive spent hours reading these posts and trying to figure this out ? cheers
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Is the said cutting out temp 76 degree's on the oil temp gauge? as mine was and I tried everything with no success,mine did turn out to be the crank sensor, after I changed this the car was fine and still is after months now.
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yeah its around that sort of temp, i think i might have a duff crank sensor ? gonna ave to spend another £47 on one to find out, best thing is euro car parts dont do refunds on electriacal parts so if its not that iv wasted more money :cry:
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I have a 97 GTI 2.0 which is having the cutting out problem. It initially started doing it a two weeks ago when driving to and from work. I replaced the coil, distributer, plugs, plug wires, cleaned the throttle body, seafoamed the car and nothing has worked. i noticed on this post that people were replacing relay 30, but i looked in my car and i dont have a relay 3, there are a couple of open spots were a relay could go. I only have the problem with it cutting out after the car is warmed up, and it is only when coming to an intersection or a stop. I have to rev the engine to 1500 rpm so it wont stall, but when it does stall i can start it up right away. I also have a problem if i floor the accelerator i get misfires on cyl 1 and 4 and the car hesitates, i let off of the gas then push it down slower and it drives normal. I have also heard that the coolant temperture sensor could be causing this problem. Please help me this is driving me crazy. :laugh:
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I'm back in this club and sick to death of this car. I had the throttle body cleaned and that sorted it out for a while. It started to cut out again, had the throttle body cleaned out again but this only solved the problem for a couple of weeks.
Now it cuts out at most lights and junctions, rather than the problems people enounter at full speed.
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Hello everyone,
I know this is an old thread but been having the dreaded symptoms. I've changed the ECU relay but no change. Next on the list is the crank angle sensor but wanted some advise first.
My car is a '96 2.0 8V gti and as well as cutting out, the car also seems to have a very minor oil leak. I'm wondering if the seals on the crank angle sensors are shot, could this possibly the source of the leak? The leak seems to be coming from the area where the sensor is located.
Also when looking at sensors, there are a few different part numbers. From what I gather, the part number is 037 906 433 but some are also abbreviated with a letter, can anyone confirm that the correct version for my car would be 037 906 433 A? Any suggestions where to get a good quality non-VAG replacement and any brands to avoid?
Cheers
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Just gone through this myself from what i hear the gsf ones are fine around £50. I got one localy for £51 and looked the exact same as the original. Avoid fuel parts one as i fitted this first and it cut out after 20 mins.
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driving up the M23 tonight inside lane doing Ahem 70ish and my 8v decides to loose power,rev gauge bouncing,ticking coming from under steering wheel (fuse box) i make it to the hard shoulder with oil lights on and a dead engine!
start the car fine pull away back to normal speed/power when it happens again! :sad:
after that i decide to stay at a steady 60 and shes fine,no problems whatsoever,this isnt the 1st time this has happened,its like she looses all power for no reason.
could this be a relay problem? which 1 to try 1st???
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Where is the RPM at when it happens? Is it at 3000?? as it could be MAF, although this is more likely to happen in all gears (I'm guessing you went over that when accellerating up to said speed) :wink: but if you didnt, and it does happen around said revs, disconnect the MAF whilst switched off, and go for a quick spin. It will still cut out eventually, but if it runs better without being connected, I would say its had it. Hope this helps. :smiley:
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thanks for that but i heard a clicking from the fuse box??? would that not indicate relay or fuse?
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clicking would be a relay. But if its clicking then its moving between contacts so should be fine. Fault may lay elsewhere.
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it happens around 80-86mph....worried what might happen at 86mph :wink:
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Well after ownership of 4 Mk3 GTi's and this being the 5th i've stumbled across the PINA that is the stalling engine!! :angry: :angry: :angry:
Mine starts, runs and is fine until the cooling fan cuts in for the second or third time and then there's the engine revs hunting, oil light flashes, relay clicks like mad and it stalls!
I've replaced the fuel pump and ECU relays - No change
In the process of changing the CPS to see if that makes any difference.... Watch this space....
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:angry:Hi im new to this and have read this thread from start to finish,
I have a mk3 gti 16v it wont start/cuts out im out of ideas i have:-
Changed the dizzy
Changed the cap and leads and plugs
Changed the coil
Changed every relay in the car
Changed the crank sensor
Taken out the aftermarket alarm
Rewired the coil as i only got 7v
Cleaned throttle body
Replaced the airmass meter
But still it wont start and if it does lasts for a short period of time its been a year now and all i want to do is hit it with a hammer. I cant even drive it to get the VAG-COM test done any help will be great or if anyones near fareham come HELP PLEASE
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Firstly are you getting a spark? second, where did you get the crank sensor from? I put one in mine and the car started an ran for 10-15 mins then cut out. It was from Partco and was cheep crap. Gsf have had good report on here around £50. Also were all the relays new or from a scrap car as they might be faulty as well the main ones are #30 and #167. Also try cleaning your isv.
Some of the 16v guys might know a bit more.
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Hi All,
Just thought I would update this thread with my experiences.
I had the cutting out issue and replaced the ECU relay, everything was fine for 6000 miles (6 months) until I changed the oil and it started cutting out again. It made sense that i may have disturbed the wiring of the crankshaft sensor, I bought a new one from a local motor factor for £43 and replaced it. It certainly needed replacing, the wire close to the sensor was corroded and falling apart.
We are now 20,000 miles (2.5 years) on, and unfortunately it has just started cutting out again.
Seems to be in different circumstances this time though, before it could happen at 70mph on the motorway, now it is slowing down for junctions, traffic lights, roundabouts etc.
At first I was wondering whether a pattern part may have been a mistake - the routing for the crankshaft wiring gets very hot. However I plugged in the VAG COM and no faults, so perhaps I will look at cleaning the throttle body etc next.
Andy
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Sounds like the crankcase breather pipe or vacuum hoses are perished or split.
Give them a good check over, mine did this and it was the crankcase breather hose caving in when lifting off the throttle and causing the car to cut out.
Put new vacuum hoses on it and take the crankcase breather pipe off and give it a good clean out. Careful though as they can be brittle. If you can see a crack/split or what not replace it as that will be your problem.
Dan
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Good shout Dan,
The crankcase breather being the solid pipe that runs from the twin rubber pipes on the top of the rocker cover down to below the dizzy somewhere??
I had it all apart at the weekend and cleaned out all of the intake and vent pipes.
I also noticed there was a fair bit of slack in the throttle cable, so i adjusted that a bit. No problems so far so hopefully its sorted.
That pipe that you mention is a bit worse for wear though so might be worth replacing that.
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Yeah thats the pipe, comes from the flying saucer on the rocker box under the black square. it goes into the crankcase by the dizzy yeah.
If it looks tired it might of perished.
I knew mine was dead when I ran an air line through it after giving it a good clean and small amount of fluid crept out the sides of it. Tiny pin holes but bad enough for it to suffocate itself when slowing down.
I have a replacement pipe somewhere that came from an Audi80. Has same ends and is the same length but slightly different shape. If your near MK feel free to come try it.
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Nice one, cheers Dan.
I'm in Oxford so may well take you up on that.
Its behaving itself at the moment, but I'll give you a shout if(when) it starts happening again!
Andy
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hi im having the same problem with my mk3 golf gti, r reg,8 v, its scary to drive :( thought vw was relable cars :( its cutting out on me and u have to wait 5 min and then it will start again :( lost confidence :( been told that it might be crank sensor so gonna change it on sat hopefully! will let everyone know if it will be fixed!! :huh:
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Generally they are. Bear in mind that your car is about 14 years old so its not gonna be without the occasional problem. :rolleyes:
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had crank sersor changed, was driving without problem for few days, few days later parked waiting for someone and it wont start :sad: after that my hubby decided to change distributor carb and something inside, and fingers x now car is running good! :rolleyes: :nerd:
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I've got cutting out problems, replaced a cap that had a hole in and was whistling then this cutting out problem started that nearly all are talking about on here, at the moment I'm crawling around at 40mph short journeys (with the cap thats got a hole in) to keep the temp down but after reading all these REALLY helpful pages I'm gonna try replacing Relay No30 part No 165906381 and check my pipes for caving when I release the throttle too.
Most on here have said that problems occuring on P reg, mines a J reg mk3 so fingers crossed.
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i had lots of problems with my r reg golf gti! crank sensor didnt helped, it was still dieing on me loads of times :( at the end been told that it might be a hall sensor( sensor near distributor carb) its was geeting hot! as it would not start , not having sparks, changed also coil pack! so fingers x its running now without dieing,cutting out on me! :nerd:
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:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: I LOVE THIS SITE :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
After reading all of this thread, I went out and purchased RELAY No30 165906381 for £15
Done 40 hard hot miles tonight to get temp right up, it's not pulled up once... My J reg is back in the land of the living again, hope this quick, cheap and easy fix lasts. You guys in here are great... keep up the good work!
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Hi everyone, my name is steve and im new on here, i have a mk 3 2ltr 16v golf gti which i bought my wife and it keeps cutting out when it reaches around 88 degrees, i have had changed crank sensor, distribitor and arm, fuel pump and relay, temp control sensor, coil, pipe leading from manifold to ecu, ecu changed and im pulling my hair out with it as its no better, its a very well looked after car other wise, having been serviced every 10k from new, it has a new dizzy cap aswell, please someone put me out of my misery as the mechanic i have working on it is puzzled aswell. thanks everyone.
Steve
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ECU relay maybe. If its doing it at the same temps each time, you could try changing temp sensor as well. :undecided:
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Just had the first experience of the engine cutting out. It wouldn't restart, aa came out. They fit a new coil pack and away I went. Happy days.
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Hi.
Having the same problem as most above. It first started couple of weeks ago.. Just would cut out whilst driving normally. I though the dizzy and leads might be damp so I sprayed a bit of wd40 to try and get rid of the moisture and it seemed to cure the problem till last night.
Noticed the temp go up to over a 100 just as I got home. Turned the car off, left it till this morning. Started fine, idled for 5 mins fine, started driving it and temp went up again over 100. Turned it off, checked water, put a little bit in. Also topped the oil up this morning.
Went for a drive and it does the same thing after about 5 mins cuts out, the revs go down, clicking noise and the oil light flashes. Leeave it for about 5 mins and will start again fine and do the same thing again.
I have changed the following -
Distributor
Crankshaft sensor
Relay 167
Any ideas what else to do? Read quite a few pages on here and no-one mentions overheating :(
Any help would be appreciated.
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I got same problems, bought my car a year ago, drove it home and it would not start for 3 weeks :sick:
spoke to the guy i bought it from and he had problems after parking over grass (engine would get damp)
got it started thought im not gonna put up with this, so booked it in for belt,tensioners,oil and filter, dizzy cap, rotor arm, Bosch super 4 plugs, leads, got it home was okish so got a new knock sensor seemed fine
now the bleedin cold is here, can take 10 mins to start, and when driving to work she cuts out when braking for traffic, roundabouts, lights, junctions for about 20mins (gotta use the gears and handbrake to slow down without cutting out)
Just got a relay #30 and still nothing :cry: if this carrys on ill torch the damn thing !!! no wonder i see so many MK3's in scrappies.
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Crank sensor? Earth issue?
I had the same issue.
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Ill have to order a VAGcom and plug it in to see !
problem is, last time i plugged it in to tech2 it only showed speed sensor (ABS sensor had gone)
Funnily enough when the car started playing up again, she cut out and when started the ABS light has been on ever since !
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Ill have to order a VAGcom and plug it in to see !
problem is, last time i plugged it in to tech2 it only showed speed sensor (ABS sensor had gone)
Funnily enough when the car started playing up again, she cut out and when started the ABS light has been on ever since !
Engine speed sensor.. isn't this the crank sensor?
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Yes.
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Cool ! Thanks guys.
Any idea how much they are ?, and how easy to change ?
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Roughly £50 and not too difficult to change, just very limited access so you'll need to support the front of the engine on a jack as you'll need to remove the front engine mount bracket for tool clearance. Be careful undoing the small hex retaining bolt as well as these tend to round off quite easily.
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Thats ok, got one of the boys in work to do it for me in the new year, as well as a new clutch and abs sensor !
Hopefully she will be running ok then, otherwise there'll be some hella twins and red n black colour con interior,fischer cd-box, votex roof bars, m3 crystal tails, BBS solitudes x8 and some other bits for sale :cry:
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Old thread I know but it is the most relavant! I had the cutting dead issue while driving, changed one of the relays ages ago but after a few months was evident it hadn't solved it, eventually it became worse and worse then one day refused to start at all after cutting out on the way to work. Replaced the crank position sensor (the one behind the engine mount / oil filter) and everything worked like a dream, that is until last week. Now the engine dies but a relay clicks and rev clock flickers for a few seconds before eventually dieing. Restarts after a few mins but dies again after only a couple of mins. Let it cool down and will run for a few miles until it warms up again. It's got to be electrical in nature as something is turning off one of the relays hence the clicking for a few seconds before cutting, the clicks correspond to loss of power too ie the engine stutters with the clicks then stops alltogether.
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hall in dizzy :undecided:
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another problem golf to the list bought mine a few months ago drove like a dream for first few months then the temp started playing up(up down up down but never over 90) changed stat then that was fine for few days then it stopped working completely. main problem car has now started to fail to start in the morn takes a good 6 turns and oil light flashes, takes a while to run right misfires for a few mins and when driving it will try to cut out but this hardly happens i changed the no30 relay just incase but still the same, please help love my car and the missus hates it now
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fixed temp sensor was gone replaced fires first time everytime
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I have the same problem, the rev counter goes down to zero first and oil light comes on, then clicking and dies altogether. Garage have replaced a fuel relay. In anyones experience, does this sound like the angle crank sensor? Please help, I love my car and I want him fixed! :cry:
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Hi IndyJ13,just developed the same problem with my 8v Gti.Cuts out when oil temp gets to about 70 degrees,oil light flashing and takes a few turns to get started again.Replaced ECU relay 30,no difference.Asked my local vw mechanic if it could be the crank sensor but he didnt seem to think so.Booked the car in with him to have a look anyway so will let you know.
Rob
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Hi IndyJ13,just developed the same problem with my 8v Gti.Cuts out when oil temp gets to about 70 degrees,oil light flashing and takes a few turns to get started again.Replaced ECU relay 30,no difference.Asked my local vw mechanic if it could be the crank sensor but he didnt seem to think so.Booked the car in with him to have a look anyway so will let you know.
Rob
As suspected,crank shaft cable worn back to the wires half way along the cable.£47 for the cable plus fitting cost.The golf now back on the road. :cool:
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Just thought I'd add my two cents and keep this amazing thread alive...
I developed similar running issues which progressively worsened until the obvious happened; I broke down.
In a nutshell, I read this entire thread beginning to end and short-listed possible causes and fixes.
The crank position sensor went to the top of that list, which I ordered and fitted over a week ago.
Touch wood, she hasn't skipped a beat since.
(http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q258/jimmerehab/VW/Crank_02_zpsek4v8hql.jpg)
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Crank sensor on my 1997 GTI was destroyed and gave me this very issue. The lead had split and broken so much it must have been shorting. Suggest replacing crank sensor, air-filter and clean the air intake/ mass airflow sensor. Bingo, all good. Runs better than before.
I recommend replacing the ECU relay (30) if you've still got problems.
It's worth mentioning this issue would only happen with the oil temperature past 80; the rev counter would stutter (up and down, whilst ticking) before dropping to 0 and cutting out the engine. Try monitoring your oil temp and see when it cuts out.