Author Topic: GTI Performance or Cupra  (Read 13814 times)

Offline mcmaddy

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 5,244
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #20 on: 18 March 2019, 13:26 »
I know this a Golf forum so it obvious we will mainly all favour the Golf. But I've got to say, I really don't think you can call the Leon Cupra cheap. Both are £30k hatchbacks build using almost identical parts. If you look at the interior, I'd say it's easily on par with the GTI. The switches all have chrome surrounds . The Alcantara looks great. The spec is as good if not better than the Golf.

This one looks fantastic value for £24k. I'd certainly also consider the ST as looks better than the Golf estate.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201901204121830?year-from=2018&make=SEAT&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&advertising-location=at_cars&aggregatedTrim=Cupra%20290&model=LEON&postcode=s37bh&sort=sponsored&radius=1500&page=1
It's 'cheaper', not 'cheap'. It's built to a cost, that cost is cheaper than a Golf build cost.

Examples off the top of my head where in that car I can see it's built cheaper than a Golf. 1) Cupholders that have no retractable/adjustable levers that keep a cup in place nor have a retractable cover. 2) Door bins that aren't totally felt lined. 3) No adjustable boot floor 4) No rubber liners in the cubby holes 5) Cheaper plastics throughout 6) smaller screen 7) Last generation LED lights. 8) No leather steering wheel 9) No door for the phone holder cubby. 9) Only three DCC settings, 10) Last generation ACC with no controls on the steering wheel. 11) Higher emission levels. Just to name but a few after a quick glance.

Small things maybe, but if you were to go through that SEAT and list it all, it would amount to a long list and add up.

It's there that matters to some people, no all, but to some. When I sit in the golf it's a superior feeling cabin, all the small things add up, so to me it's worth the extra money.

I don't see that car as fantastic value, I see it as a 6mth old £24k Seat, my immediate reaction would be what £25k would get me from VW.
These might be an issue on a lower down Leon but certainly not on the Cupra. Just an example but it does have leather steering wheel and dual boot levels. Three damper modes? It's exactly the same system that's in the golf. Also slightly strange they complain about the diff on those articles mentioned, it's exactly the same diff that's in the golf yet everyone loves that. Only thing I'd agree with is the suspension bushes which are crap 👍
« Last Edit: 18 March 2019, 13:32 by mcmaddy »
TCR, Pure Grey, DCC, Dynaudio and Climate Screen.

Offline kmpowell

  • I live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 789
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #21 on: 18 March 2019, 13:31 »
I know this a Golf forum so it obvious we will mainly all favour the Golf. But I've got to say, I really don't think you can call the Leon Cupra cheap. Both are £30k hatchbacks build using almost identical parts. If you look at the interior, I'd say it's easily on par with the GTI. The switches all have chrome surrounds . The Alcantara looks great. The spec is as good if not better than the Golf.

This one looks fantastic value for £24k. I'd certainly also consider the ST as looks better than the Golf estate.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201901204121830?year-from=2018&make=SEAT&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&advertising-location=at_cars&aggregatedTrim=Cupra%20290&model=LEON&postcode=s37bh&sort=sponsored&radius=1500&page=1
It's 'cheaper', not 'cheap'. It's built to a cost, that cost is cheaper than a Golf build cost.

Examples off the top of my head where in that car I can see it's built cheaper than a Golf. 1) Cupholders that have no retractable/adjustable levers that keep a cup in place nor have a retractable cover. 2) Door bins that aren't totally felt lined. 3) No adjustable boot floor 4) No rubber liners in the cubby holes 5) Cheaper plastics throughout 6) smaller screen 7) Last generation LED lights. 8) No leather steering wheel 9) No door for the phone holder cubby. 9) Only three DCC settings, 10) Last generation ACC with no controls on the steering wheel. 11) Higher emission levels. Just to name but a few after a quick glance.

Small things maybe, but if you were to go through that SEAT and list it all, it would amount to a long list and add up.

It's there that matters to some people, no all, but to some. When I sit in the golf it's a superior feeling cabin, all the small things add up, so to me it's worth the extra money.

I don't see that car as fantastic value, I see it as a 6mth old £24k Seat, my immediate reaction would be what £25k would get me from VW.
These might be an issue on a lower down Leon but certainly not on the Cupra. Just an example but it does have leather steering wheel and dual boot levels. Three damper modes? It's exactly the same system that's in the golf.
I’d suggest you look at the pictures of the car in the link. That car is a Cupra and that car has all the things I mention.

Yes, the Cupra only has three DCC/Drive modes (Comfort, Sport, Cupra), there’s 4 in the Golf (Eco, Comfort, Normal, Sport). It’s not the same, it's set-up differently and gives different options/flexibility. Damper rates are also different on the Cupra.
« Last Edit: 18 March 2019, 13:54 by kmpowell »
SOLD March 2021
2019 GTI Performance, 5DR, DSG - Isaac Blue, Leather, Pan Roof, 19" Brescias, DCC, Dynaudio, Rear Camera, Keyless, Electric Memory Driver Seat.

Offline Jim_mk7.5

  • I live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,388
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #22 on: 18 March 2019, 13:46 »
I know this a Golf forum so it obvious we will mainly all favour the Golf. But I've got to say, I really don't think you can call the Leon Cupra cheap. Both are £30k hatchbacks build using almost identical parts. If you look at the interior, I'd say it's easily on par with the GTI. The switches all have chrome surrounds . The Alcantara looks great. The spec is as good if not better than the Golf.

This one looks fantastic value for £24k. I'd certainly also consider the ST as looks better than the Golf estate.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201901204121830?year-from=2018&make=SEAT&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&advertising-location=at_cars&aggregatedTrim=Cupra%20290&model=LEON&postcode=s37bh&sort=sponsored&radius=1500&page=1
It's 'cheaper', not 'cheap'. It's built to a cost, that cost is cheaper than a Golf build cost.

Examples off the top of my head where in that car I can see it's built cheaper than a Golf. 1) Cupholders that have no retractable/adjustable levers that keep a cup in place nor have a retractable cover. 2) Door bins that aren't totally felt lined. 3) No adjustable boot floor 4) No rubber liners in the cubby holes 5) Cheaper plastics throughout 6) smaller screen 7) Last generation LED lights. 8) No leather steering wheel 9) No door for the phone holder cubby. 9) Only three DCC settings, 10) Last generation ACC with no controls on the steering wheel. 11) Higher emission levels. Just to name but a few after a quick glance.

Small things maybe, but if you were to go through that SEAT and list it all, it would amount to a long list and add up.

It's there that matters to some people, no all, but to some. When I sit in the golf it's a superior feeling cabin, all the small things add up, so to me it's worth the extra money.

I don't see that car as fantastic value, I see it as a 6mth old £24k Seat, my immediate reaction would be what £25k would get me from VW.

The car is the link:

Flat bottomed perforated leather steering wheel with white stitching and CUPRA logo

Let's be honest, we could say it has things the Golf doesn't get as standard for similar money - DCC, 19s, better active display, gloss black mirrors and I'm sure they are other things.

We're all driving Golfs but it doesn't mean the Cupra isn't still a good car and may offer better value for money.
NOW - 330e M Sport
GONE - 2018 Mk7.5 GTI Performance 5dr DSG, Tungsten Silver, 2017 Mk7.5 GTI 5dr DSG, Indium Grey


Offline kmpowell

  • I live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 789
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #23 on: 18 March 2019, 14:02 »
I know this a Golf forum so it obvious we will mainly all favour the Golf. But I've got to say, I really don't think you can call the Leon Cupra cheap. Both are £30k hatchbacks build using almost identical parts. If you look at the interior, I'd say it's easily on par with the GTI. The switches all have chrome surrounds . The Alcantara looks great. The spec is as good if not better than the Golf.

This one looks fantastic value for £24k. I'd certainly also consider the ST as looks better than the Golf estate.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201901204121830?year-from=2018&make=SEAT&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&advertising-location=at_cars&aggregatedTrim=Cupra%20290&model=LEON&postcode=s37bh&sort=sponsored&radius=1500&page=1
It's 'cheaper', not 'cheap'. It's built to a cost, that cost is cheaper than a Golf build cost.

Examples off the top of my head where in that car I can see it's built cheaper than a Golf. 1) Cupholders that have no retractable/adjustable levers that keep a cup in place nor have a retractable cover. 2) Door bins that aren't totally felt lined. 3) No adjustable boot floor 4) No rubber liners in the cubby holes 5) Cheaper plastics throughout 6) smaller screen 7) Last generation LED lights. 8) No leather steering wheel 9) No door for the phone holder cubby. 9) Only three DCC settings, 10) Last generation ACC with no controls on the steering wheel. 11) Higher emission levels. Just to name but a few after a quick glance.

Small things maybe, but if you were to go through that SEAT and list it all, it would amount to a long list and add up.

It's there that matters to some people, no all, but to some. When I sit in the golf it's a superior feeling cabin, all the small things add up, so to me it's worth the extra money.

I don't see that car as fantastic value, I see it as a 6mth old £24k Seat, my immediate reaction would be what £25k would get me from VW.

The car is the link:

Flat bottomed perforated leather steering wheel with white stitching and CUPRA logo

Let's be honest, we could say it has things the Golf doesn't get as standard for similar money - DCC, 19s, better active display, gloss black mirrors and I'm sure they are other things.

We're all driving Golfs but it doesn't mean the Cupra isn't still a good car and may offer better value for money.
We appear to be going round in circles here...

The Seat is a "cheaper" car (than the Golf), not a "cheap" car. The Seat is built to a cost, and that cost is cheaper than a Golf. That's not really up for debate, that's a fact publicised by the VAG group. The steering wheel may be leather on paper, but look at it, does it look like leather, it's clearly a much cheaper leather/material, it looks (and no doubt feels) cheaper because it's built to a cheaper cost.

Value for money is subjective. What you may class as VFM, is not another person's opinion. I don't see the Seat as value for money, I see it as an inferior product to the Golf in many ways. That's not to say I'm right, or you are right, it's to say VFM is subjective.

But when the lines get blurred and people (not you I might add) start arguing subjective opinions as facts, the argument becomes a nonsense.

A Golf GTI PP is a "better" car than Cupra,and that's nothing to do with brand snobbery, it's to do with cold hard facts of build costs, material costs, and trim. That's not to say a Cupra isn't a good car, it just simply isn't comparable like for like. Different products, built to different costs, aimed at different audiences (budgets).

 :smiley:
SOLD March 2021
2019 GTI Performance, 5DR, DSG - Isaac Blue, Leather, Pan Roof, 19" Brescias, DCC, Dynaudio, Rear Camera, Keyless, Electric Memory Driver Seat.

Offline dubber36

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 5,536
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #24 on: 18 March 2019, 16:58 »
Anyone would think these two cars were miles apart. We're not comparing a Citigo with an R8 here, but to read words like "inferior" in this context is a bit strong. Despite what you might say, it really does smack of brand snobbery.
Red Mk6 gone replaced with a white Mk7 which has gone too. Green Mk2 here to stay.

Offline kmpowell

  • I live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 789
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #25 on: 18 March 2019, 17:35 »
Anyone would think these two cars were miles apart.
They're not miles apart, nobody is saying they are. They are priced accordingly.

We're not comparing a Citigo with an R8 here, but to read words like "inferior" in this context is a bit strong.
We're comparing two products that are priced at different levels. A price that's based (and reflected) in the items used to build the products. It really is that simple, a very simple business concept. This is not the same product being sold at different prices, it's two different products, and one is cheaper than the other because it's errr ummm, made cheaper, so yes there are inferior elements to it.  :huh:

Despite what you might say, it really does smack of brand snobbery.
Despite what you might say, it's not, it's simple maths and product understanding. People's personal opinion of Value For Money is then layered on top.

Brand snobbery only comes into play if you are comparing exactly the same product but badged differently, in this case we are not.
SOLD March 2021
2019 GTI Performance, 5DR, DSG - Isaac Blue, Leather, Pan Roof, 19" Brescias, DCC, Dynaudio, Rear Camera, Keyless, Electric Memory Driver Seat.

Offline mcmaddy

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 5,244
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #26 on: 18 March 2019, 20:49 »
99% of the parts you'll pull off a Cupra will be exactly the same as what is on an Audi, Skoda and VW. It's the perception that you're getting a better car that sucks people in. All this nonsense saying it's built to a cost, every car is built to a cost and unless you hadn't noticed VW seem to been doing more cost cutting than other brands within the vag group. Is the Cupra cheap or the Golf over priced? Probably a bit of both but VW are living off the heritage of yesteryear and other brands are becoming more desirable.
TCR, Pure Grey, DCC, Dynaudio and Climate Screen.

Offline Guzzle

  • I live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,047
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #27 on: 18 March 2019, 22:55 »
5 things I prefer about the Golf GTi over the Leon Cupra;-

1) Cabin design is a bit nicer.
2) Some of the interior plastics are a bit nicer.
3) Winter pack is available with cloth seats.
4) Rear camera is available.
5) Heated front screen is available. 

5 things I prefer about the Leon Cupra over the Golf GTi;-

1) Better choice of paint colours (and they're all 'free'!)
2) Nicer alloy wheel design.
3) More customisable digital dash.
4) The price to spec ratio. A standard car is about £3k cheaper after discount. A fully loaded Cupra Lux is still nearly £2k cheaper after discount. A similarly specced Golf GTi is almost £6k more than a Cupra Lux after discount.
5) More power!

This is merely my opinion. Feel free to disagree amongst yourselves  :smiley:
7.5 GTD

Offline mcmaddy

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 5,244
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #28 on: 18 March 2019, 23:15 »
The Cupra Lux apparently comes with a camera although the salesman I spoke to didn't have a clue  :grin: :grin:
TCR, Pure Grey, DCC, Dynaudio and Climate Screen.

Offline Guzzle

  • I live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,047
Re: GTI Performance or Cupra
« Reply #29 on: 18 March 2019, 23:19 »
The Cupra Lux apparently comes with a camera although the salesman I spoke to didn't have a clue  :grin: :grin:

Where did you find that info? The price list states Xcellence models only for the rear camera  :undecided:
« Last Edit: 18 March 2019, 23:22 by Guzzle »
7.5 GTD